Oral Questions

1. to the Minister of Health: What is the Government doing to keep the public informed of the steps they can take to protect themselves against COVID-19?

Yesterday, I launched the Unite against COVID-19 public health campaign, alongside the influenza vaccination drive. The $10 million COVID-19 public health campaign has a simple call to action. It asks New Zealanders to support each other and to do everything they can to slow the spread of COVID-19.

💬 Willow-Jean Prime: What does the public health campaign ask people to do?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: The campaign has four very simple messages that everyone needs to follow. Firstly, wash your hands with soap for 20 seconds, then dry them. Do this often. This kills the virus by bursting its protective bubble. Secondly, stay home if you’re sick. If you have a fever, a cough, shortness of breath, sneezing, or a runny nose, don’t go to work or school. Thirdly, self-isolate for 14 days if you have been overseas or if you have been in contact with someone who has COVID-19. And, fourthly, be kind. Check in on your neighbours, especially older or vulnerable people. Make sure they have what they need to get through this.

💬 Willow-Jean Prime: How will people hear or see these public health messages?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: Every single New Zealander must and will see these messages. We have an initial spend of around $10 million to ensure this happens. The campaign began yesterday and is already appearing on social media, radio, TV, in newspapers, and on billboards, and will increase in coming days.

Question No. 2—Prime Minister

2. to the Prime Minister: Does she stand by all her Government’s statements and actions?

on behalf of the Prime Minister: On behalf of the Prime Minister, yes.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: Is it correct that she and her Government have been receiving daily situation reports on COVID-19 and that yesterday was day 58?

On behalf of the Prime Minister, yes.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: If the Government has been receiving situation reports for 58 days in a row, why, then, couldn’t the Ministry of Health tell journalists how many ventilators there are in the country as soon as a couple of days ago?

The reality is that the Minister referred the questioner to the various health boards around the country to give an update as to the existing ones they’ve got, those that can be possibly brought into use as fast as possible with some work, and that’s the updated situation. We’re working on it as we speak.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: Does the Prime Minister think, though, that the Government should know how many ventilators there are in the country?

The reality is the Government does know now how many ventilators there are in the country and those that have not been used of late but are being updated or brought back into action as fast as we possibly can. Then there are other alternatives as well, including offshore purchasing.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: Will there be a proactive release of Cabinet papers and daily situation reports which show why the Government are making certain decisions around COVID-19?

On behalf of the Prime Minister, the matter of transparency for the Government is so obvious. We need the country all to be aware of what the Government is seeking to do in cooperation with the people of New Zealand. So transparency is not the primary issue at the moment. The major issue at the moment is solving the problem we face in terms of an enemy from without that’s causing an economic and health crisis, and to stand here posturing about politics and trying to make personal advantage does that party no credit whatsoever.

💬 Jami-Lee Ross: Does she agree with the Director-General of Health’s advice that the 16 cases in the last two days were all overseas-travel related, and if so, has she sought or received any advice on closing the border to all non-citizens and non-residents?

That’s an excellent question. The reality is that as of today, there are 28 and they all are connected with overseas travel—all 28—and so the answer to the member’s question will be, in my view, one that we will be imminently looking at, and will be able to give you an answer not now but, I think, very, very soon.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: How much scrutiny are customs officials giving to visitors arriving to check whether they know about self-isolation and how they plan to carry it out?

On behalf of the Prime Minister, all scrutiny possible is now being applied to incoming passengers, including having a police force alongside our customs officials and others to ensure that they get to understand how serious this issue is.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: What consideration, if any, has the Government given to requiring inbound international flights to screen information, videos, and/or to hand out information pamphlets in different languages on the planes around COVID-19 and the rules in New Zealand?

At the moment, the consideration of that has already been a fact. But the reality is that international airlines are shutting down their passage to New Zealand at the moment, and we are suggesting to New Zealanders not to leave this country at the moment: just don’t travel, in the interests of preserving the safety of the people of this country. Giving out the kind of information that that member is referring to is a thing of the past in this context, because there won’t be any travel.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: Are people arriving in New Zealand today from an overseas country that may have COVID-19, and that’s why they are required to self-isolate, and could better information consistently be given to them by Government officials?

On behalf of the Prime Minister, new arrival cards have already been published, printed, and issued, and are being issued as we speak.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: Can the Prime Minister accept I’m not asking about information cards that they fill out but information given to the visitors so that they understand the rules of New Zealand for them coming in, what self-isolation actually means, and are given the right information at the right time, and not open to rumour and innuendo?

On behalf of the Prime Minister, I am so glad that it’s not open to rumour and innuendo, because that’s what we’ve heard from some sources thus far, sad to say. But the reality is they’re given all the information, they’re told exactly what it means in terms of self-isolation, and in every way the guidance that was given by the Minister of Health is passed on to them as well. Plus, they’re told, “If you don’t keep your word and we find you, you’ll be right out of this country. You’ll never be able to come back in.”

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: They’re not told that.

Yes, they are.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: Are people arriving in New Zealand from Pacific Islands where they don’t have COVID-19 at the moment and so do not have to self-isolate, then standing in queues at the airport with people arriving from other countries that do have COVID-19 and are required to self-isolate?

It’s very hard to imagine how people from the Islands—for example, from Samoa, and are coming on a plane that is out of Samoa—will have people from Europe in the same queue, because they will be on different flights.

Question No. 3—Transport

3. to the Minister of Transport: Will he cancel the 3.5 cents per litre petrol excise increase due to take effect from 1 July this year, to reduce costs on consumers during the predicted recession?

on behalf of the Minister of Transport: On behalf of the Minister of Transport, our Government is very concerned about the impact of COVID-19 on the economy and on our communities. That’s why we’ve moved quickly with an initial $12.1 billion package to support New Zealand workers and businesses. This morning, I ruled out any further increases for the next three years, but we have no current plans to cancel this year’s increase.

Question No. 4—Police

4. to the Minister of Police: What advice has he received about the Police’s role in responding to COVID-19?

I’m advised that the New Zealand Police are working closely with the Ministry of Health to help deal with a dynamic situation that is COVID-19. The Commissioner of Police is providing operational strategic oversight to the all-of-Government response. Police’s main role at this time is to help the Ministry of Health enforce the new self-isolation requirements that came into effect on 16 March. For example, on Tuesday, 17 March, at the direction of the Ministry of Health, police conducted compliance and welfare visits on a random sample group of travellers who had arrived into New Zealand after the new self-isolation requirements came into effect. Police say they are pleased with the high level of compliance and report that most people are taking the self-isolation requirements seriously.

💬 Greg O’Connor: What advice has he received about compliance with the requirements to self-isolate?

💬 Hon STUART NASH: As the Prime Minister has stated, more than 10,000 people have already voluntarily self-isolated before the new self-isolation rules came into force on Monday. I have been advised that a range of front-line agencies, including Police, Immigration, and Health are receiving tip-offs from the public. As of yesterday, police received 90 COVID-19 - related calls in this first two days of the new rules. Most of these reports were from members of the public who suspected breaches of self-isolation by others. This is promising to see as it shows that neighbours, families, workplaces, and the community recognise that everyone has a part to play to contain the spread of COVID-19. Government agencies like the police cannot do it on their own. We are all in this together.

💬 Greg O’Connor: What advice has he received from police about what members of the public can do if they suspect someone is in breach of the new self-isolation rules?

💬 Hon STUART NASH: Police advise me that if a member of the public suspects a breach of the self-isolation rules, they can email. I would like all the members to note this down and send it out on their social media or other platforms. This is the email address: nhccselfisolation@health.govt.nz. That’s “nhccselfisolation”—one word—“@health.govt.nz”. They can include details or screenshots from social media as appropriate. In the last year, police have been tested by extraordinary events from the Tasman wildfires, the terror attacks, the eruption at Whaakari / White Island, and now COVID-19. But I would like to reassure members of this House and members of the general public that police’s top priority is, as always, keeping our communities safe.

Question No. 5—Finance

5. to the Minister of Finance: What are the assumptions behind the estimated $5.1 billion cost of the Government’s COVID-19 wage subsidy scheme; in particular, how many workers does the Government estimate will be subsidised by the scheme?

on behalf of the Minister of Finance: The estimated cost of the Government’s 12-week, $5.1 billion wage subsidy scheme to support jobs and businesses assumes approximately 50 percent of employers, including the self-employed and sole traders, take up the scheme. That estimates approximately 270,000 employers and self-employed and sole traders taking up the scheme. This is comprised of approximately 10,000 larger employers with greater than 20 employees and approximately 260,000 employers with fewer than 20 employees or self-employed sole traders. Accordingly, the $5.1 billion package was estimated to directly benefit approximately 750,000 working New Zealanders, but, of course, the wider macroeconomic impact will clearly be larger.

💬 Hon Paul Goldsmith: So what percentage of businesses in New Zealand would have to apply for their full entitlement of up to 21 full-time workers for the $5.1 billion to be spent?

Sorry; could the member just repeat that question?

💬 Hon Paul Goldsmith: So, roughly, what percentage of businesses in New Zealand would have to apply for their full entitlement of up to 21 full-time workers for the $5.1 billion to be spent?

In the answer that I gave, the estimate is that of the 270,000 employers, self-employed, and sole traders who take up the scheme, 260,000 of them will have 20 or fewer employees or be self-employed or sole traders.

💬 Hon Paul Goldsmith: Is he assuming that virtually all businesses of fewer than 20 employees will face a 30 percent drop in revenue, in order to qualify for the scheme?

No. I think it’s clear that it seems to be others that are suggesting that every wage and salary earner in New Zealand should have their earnings guaranteed by the Government. If that is indeed the position of the Opposition, they should confirm that to the media.

💬 Hon Paul Goldsmith: Did he consider devoting a greater proportion of Tuesday’s economic package to urgent relief to businesses and their workers so that they could save more jobs now?

I’m advised that by earlier today, already 16,200 applications for wage subsidy have been received, together with 676 COVID-19 leave applications. I’m further advised that these applications collectively cover more than 50,000 working New Zealanders and that some payments have already been made and more have been authorised. I believe that this is an incredibly fast start by the Public Service, and I’m confident that I speak on behalf of the whole of this House to commend them.

💬 Hon Paul Goldsmith: Why will he not release the Cabinet paper today so that we can understand the workings behind it all?

💬 SPEAKER: No, I’m going to ask the member to rephrase the question. There’s an assumption in the question which hasn’t been established by the facts. “He will not”—I mean, that’s a for ever thing.

💬 Hon Paul Goldsmith: Will he release the Cabinet paper behind the economic package today?

As the Deputy Prime Minister on behalf of the Prime Minister today has noted, we are endeavouring to be transparent in respect of these issues. I think we have been open as to the primary question and the detail that the member has provided. If he wants some further statistical information, we’re willing to consider that. In respect of the release of the overall papers, that will be dealt with in accordance with the law.

💬 Kieran McAnulty: What has been the response to the support package from leaders in areas heavily dependent on tourism? [Interruption]

The—

💬 SPEAKER: Sorry, can I just interrupt and ask who’s got something that’s dinging in here? [Interruption] Can I ask the people in the immediate vicinity of the Deputy Prime Minister to—there’s a dinging that’s occurring that even I can hear. So can everyone in this general area make sure that their phones are turned off. Right, the Hon David Parker.

I think you might have pinged the wrong person, sir.

💬 SPEAKER: I said in the general area.

Oh, thank you—thank you, sir. The Wānaka Sun reports that the Queenstown Lakes District Mayor, Jim Boult, has welcomed the package, saying, “Minister Robertson and his government colleagues are to be congratulated for recognising the pain that coronavirus has brought to the industry and New Zealand generally, but in particular to our district. We applaud this and thank the government for their swift intervention.”, and he also notes the significance of the Reserve Bank announcement on interest rates, also this week.

💬 Hon Paul Goldsmith: Why will he not release the Cabinet paper behind the economic package today?

I’m sure the Cabinet paper will be released.

💬 Rt Hon Winston Peters: As a precedent, can he recall any former time when such a request was made in this House and met?

I don’t recall the detail of the incidents around the Christchurch earthquake or the Kaikōura response, but I am sure that the methodology and the time frames that were met in respect of those incidents by the Public Service—who is the one that processes these requests—will be similar to the response by this Government.

💬 Hon Paul Goldsmith: Does he not consider the very rapid-moving situation that we’re facing does justify getting as much information out in the public domain so that New Zealanders can understand the basis upon which these major economic decisions are being made?

The Public Service is concentrating on enabling the businesses—and be they self-employed or employees, the Public Service is focusing on getting them the help that they need, not the release of the paper to the Opposition, which, none the less, will be handled promptly and in accordance with the law.

Question No. 6—Health

6. to the Minister of Health: What is the best estimate of the number of COVID-19 testing kits currently available for use in New Zealand, and is he satisfied that is sufficient to meet projected demand?

Internationally, COVID-19 outbreaks are testing the capacity of even the most prepared health systems. That’s why we are putting such a strong focus on stamping out the sporadic cases we’ve seen in New Zealand to flatten and supress the curve and reduce pressure on our health service. Testing kits are comprised of various components, including swabs, probes, primers, and enzymes. I’m advised that we have around 30,000 swabs in New Zealand, with 90,000 more on order. I’m also advised we have sufficient supply of reagent for the near future, and we have more on order, and we’re expecting that to arrive soon. As part of the $500 million investment in health announced earlier this week, $5 million has already been allocated to increasing testing capacity. Specialised testing machines are critical. An additional machine is expected to arrive shortly at the Auckland laboratory. Most importantly, testing capacity relies on highly skilled technicians to perform the tests and interpret the results. We now have four laboratories in operation across New Zealand. Finally, I’m advised that in the 24 hours to midnight last night, more than 1,000 tests for COVID-19 were performed. I want to take this time now to thank the hard-working laboratory staff that are doing this important work.

💬 Hon Michael Woodhouse: Are reports of global test kit shortages accurate, and if so, what measures, if any, is he taking to reduce the impact on New Zealand?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: We are putting a strong focus on stamping out the sporadic cases we’ve seen in New Zealand, to flatten and suppress the curve and reduce pressure on our health services. We are working, of course, to ensure we have all of the necessary components of testing kits, and I’ve given the member indications around the fact that we have sufficient orders, and I’m advised that we have sufficient stocks currently. Of course, we are looking to make sure that is the case into the future.

💬 Hon Michael Woodhouse: Does he believe that testing according to the current case definition criteria of close contact with an infected person and symptoms will prevent a sustained community outbreak?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: The things that will prevent an outbreak are people taking the public health advice seriously. That includes not going out when they’re ill, observing the self-isolation requirements in New Zealand for travellers, washing of hands regularly, sneezing into elbows. Those are the measures that will prevent community outbreaks.

💬 Hon Michael Woodhouse: Does he agree that the number of close contacts of the 28 confirmed cases are the equivalent of less than two days of testing capacity, and does he agree that testing them, notwithstanding they might not have symptoms, is prudent?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: Could the member please repeat that question?

💬 Hon Michael Woodhouse: Does he agree that the number of close contacts of the 28 confirmed cases number the equivalent of fewer than two days’ testing capacity, and does he agree that testing them, notwithstanding that they might not have symptoms, is prudent?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: I will answer that question as best as I understand it.

💬 SPEAKER: I’m actually going to ask the member to ask it again, because I think it could have been clearer.

💬 Hon Michael Woodhouse: Can he confirm that the close contacts of the 28 confirmed cases number between 1,000 and 2,000—less than two days’ testing capacity—and would he not agree that it would be prudent to test them, notwithstanding that most of them will not be symptomatic?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: Of the 28 cases we have so far, I would note that they’ve come in over many weeks and many of the close contacts have long since been followed up with.

💬 Hon Michael Woodhouse: Who decided the 150 children at Logan Park High School and their teachers would be tested, and are all of them symptomatic?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: Clinical experts advised that this was a unique circumstance and that it was appropriate to test in this case.

💬 Hon Michael Woodhouse: Well, will he join me in encouraging those clinical experts to continue to take a broader approach to testing to reduce the likelihood of a community outbreak, and providing peace of mind to the public?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: I will continue to encourage the clinical experts to use their clinical expertise and not the judgment of politicians.

Question No. 7—Customs

7. to the Minister of Customs: What precautions are being taken at the border to help slow the spread of COVID-19?

This morning, I was at Auckland international airport, our country’s largest passenger port, to ensure our strict border measures are being enforced. There are measures in place. Passengers are being questioned; they’re being stopped and required to hand over detailed information. One cannot miss the signage and the public address announcements at the airport. The responsibility of self-isolation is being made clear to all travellers. However, I am concerned about the experience reported by some of our travellers, which is why I physically went to Auckland Airport this morning. I saw areas where we can and should improve our overall border response, and I have tasked agencies with addressing these concerns immediately.

💬 Ginny Andersen: Why isn’t the Government testing people for COVID-19 at the border?

💬 Hon JENNY SALESA: Because testing people who are asymptomatic at the border will not necessarily address the issues. During the incubation period, it is impossible to test for COVID-19, as per the advice we have from public health officials. Tests only work when symptoms are showing—this is the advice from the Ministry of Health and from the World Health Organization. We do not—I repeat: do not—want people entering Aotearoa New Zealand falsely believing that they do not have COVID-19 and not self-isolating for 14 days. Our instruction to travellers remains the same: self-isolation will help slow down the spread of COVID-19.

💬 Ginny Andersen: What are the consequences for those that don’t follow the rules at the border?

💬 Hon JENNY SALESA: We have the full force of the law. We have the customs Act; the powers of customs. We have the powers of public health. We can fine, we can detain, and we can deport these people when they do not adhere to our rules.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: Are customs giving all visitors to New Zealand a handout that they can keep, giving them information on self-isolation and the rules in New Zealand?

💬 Hon JENNY SALESA: What I saw this morning at the Auckland international airport is that it is very clear as you come through. People are stopped as they come out of the international airport, are asked about self-isolation—

💬 Hon Jacqui Dean: Why don’t you just answer the question?

💬 Hon JENNY SALESA: —given the handout for—I am answering the question—

💬 Hon Jacqui Dean: No, you’re not.

💬 Hon JENNY SALESA: —given the handout for self-isolation—

💬 SPEAKER: Order! The member will resume her seat. That member will stop reflecting on me. Jenny Salesa, complete the answer.

💬 Hon JENNY SALESA: People are handed information on self-isolation. They then have to go through health staff again, and at the customs area they are again talked to, given information, and asked questions about self-isolation. There is no way that you would not know about self-isolating for 14 days in New Zealand.

💬 Hon Jacqui Dean: She doesn’t know.

💬 Hon JENNY SALESA: I do; I’ve just been visiting.

💬 Jami-Lee Ross: Why has the border not been closed to non-citizens and non-residents to help slow the spread of COVID-19?

💬 Hon JENNY SALESA: We have one of the strongest restrictions at the border compared to other countries. What the member should know is that the majority of the people coming through our border right now are New Zealanders; they’re either New Zealand citizens or they’re New Zealand permanent residents. We are doing as much as we can to ensure that our borders are secure.

Question No. 8—Health

8. to the Minister of Health: How many respiratory ventilators are available across the health system, and is he satisfied that New Zealand’s health system is prepared for an outbreak of COVID-19?

Internationally, COVID-19 outbreaks are testing the capacity of even the most prepared health systems. That’s why we are putting such a strong focus on stamping out the sporadic cases we’ve seen in New Zealand—to flatten and suppress the curve and reduce pressure on our health service. I’m advised that 238 ventilators are available in ICU and high-dependency unit beds. There are also 44 mobile ventilators across the public health system and 24 ventilators available at private hospitals. Some operating theatres and post-operative areas also have ventilators that could be used if necessary. DHB planning is also well advanced to ensure that we have the staff available in the right place at the right time, to ensure the best use of equipment as required. The priority is to scale up capacity, and that’s why the Government has invested $32 million to purchase additional ventilated and non-ventilated ICU capacity as part of the $500 million package for health announced earlier this week, to back our health professionals to combat COVID-19. Health workers are working around the clock to make this happen, and I want to thank them for this.

💬 Dr Shane Reti: At any one time, what percentage of the ventilators he has just mentioned are already in use most of the time for urgent care?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: I don’t have the exact number on that in front of me, but what I can say is that the member will know that historically, under-investment in our health system has meant that the number of ventilators is not as many as in some of the other health systems around the world. That, of course, is why we are putting such a strong focus on stamping out the sporadic cases we’ve seen in New Zealand to flatten and suppress the curve and reduce the pressure on our health service.

💬 Dr Shane Reti: How quickly can nationwide ventilator capacity be increased?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: I appreciate that people want simple answers to complex questions. For example, I’m aware that—[Interruption]

💬 SPEAKER: Order! Can I say that some of the prefixes that the Minister’s using are winding up the Opposition and it means that I can’t hear the answer. If he could just go straight to answering the question it would be useful.

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: I will endeavour to do that. I am aware that work is under way looking at the feasibility of returning to service some recently retired equipment. We also need to ensure that we have the staff available to operate that vital equipment, and I understand that additional training is already under way. What I can assure the House is that we will use this investment wisely, and if more funding is required, it will be made available.

💬 Dr Shane Reti: Are there currently more ventilators than there are qualified medical staff to run them?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: Again, I do want to say that it’s not quite as straightforward as that question sounds. We do have to plan for the contingency that some staff may not be well or may be in self-isolation. That is already the case in our health system. So there are a range of complex planning activities under way to ensure that we are as well prepared as anywhere else.

💬 Dr Shane Reti: When he said in this House on Tuesday, no, he didn’t know how many coronavirus cases a day an average general practice had protective equipment for, does he know today how many coronavirus cases a day an average general practice has protective equipment for, and what is that number?

💬 SPEAKER: That question has no relationship with the primary or the supplementary.

💬 Dr Shane Reti: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. Thank you. The primary question also asked about whether the health system is prepared for an outbreak of COVID-19, and I would submit—

💬 SPEAKER: Yes, and subsequent clauses to primary questions relate to the primary part of the question, otherwise it would be two questions. Question No. 9—the Hon Nikki Kaye. Question No. 10—Marama Davidson.

Question No. 10—Social Development

10. to the Minister for Social Development: What support is this Government providing for people most in need in light of the impacts of COVID-19?

Alongside initiatives that strengthen business continuity, the Government’s economic response package has three key initiatives that support people at most need during this time. From 1 April, those on main benefits will see a boost of $25 per week; from 1 May, to further support beneficiaries and superannuitants, the winter energy payment will be doubled in 2020; and, lastly, from 1 July, working families with children who are not on a benefit will no longer have to satisfy the hours test to receive the in-work tax credit. These initiatives alone represent an investment of more than $2.8 billion over the next four years. It is a significant investment to get in front of the impacts of COVID-19 and support individuals and families most in need.

💬 Marama Davidson: How will these changes support communities and local businesses through this difficult time?

💬 Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: We know that people on low incomes spend what they have to cover essential costs. This investment is a boost to consumer spending. It will go to local business and local communities, and that’s good for everyone. Spending through our local businesses, be they big or small, helps employers to keep people employed. We also know that providing a boost to those on the lowest incomes is a tried and true instrument to support people during times such as these. This just makes sense and is the right thing to do to support people in the most need.

💬 Marama Davidson: Why is it important for the country that we provide this extra support for those in need to care for themselves and their whānau?

💬 Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: Main benefits and the winter energy payment reach around one million Kiwi homes every year—largely superannuitants. We know that this is likely to increase. We also expect that the changes to the in-work tax credit are likely to provide a boost to around 19,000 families in work. As I noted yesterday, Mangere Budgeting Services believe that the increase in main benefits alone would likely help people buy another three or four meals a week. These changes can mean that people most in need can be less stressed about being able to meet some of their essential costs during a time of significant economic impact. Our response to COVID-19 must place our people at the centre, and that’s exactly what we’re doing.

💬 Marama Davidson: As the impacts of COVID-19 deepen, what further support will the Government be looking to provide for those most vulnerable?

💬 Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: As the Minister of Finance noted on Tuesday, it’s only the beginning of what this Government will do to support New Zealanders through this time of crisis and lead our recovery and rebuilding. We know in these extraordinary times that we need to be watching closely how those already most in need are faring, which we are. I am encouraged, though, by the actions we had already taken as a Government prior to the economic response package to ensure we were poised and ready to support people in need, including the stand-up of the Government helpline, the deployment of rapid-response teams, and the removal of stand-down periods, which comes into force on Monday. The incredible work of the Ministry of Social Development, and indeed across the entire public sector, cannot be understated. Will there be more to do? Undoubtedly, yes. We will assess and act as we go. However, it’s not only Government that are acting; business, communities, and social services—everyone is doing their bit. We need to continue looking out for each other.

💬 SPEAKER: Members will have noticed that I moved, when Nikki Kaye didn’t take the call for her question, on to the following question. I’ve had an indication from the Minister of Education that he thinks it’s an important question. He would like to go back, and therefore I seek leave of the House, looking very carefully so that it is granted, to now move back to question No. 9. Is there any objection? There appears to be none.

Question No. 9—Education

9. to the Minister of Education: Is he confident that the Government is taking all necessary measures in our education system to reduce the impact of COVID-19 and keep people safe?

Yes. As I’ve said to the member, and said publicly, it is a rapidly evolving situation and advice is being updated and is changing. Health officials and education officials are working very closely together to keep people safe. They have agreed a joint protocol, which they’re implementing, which takes into account a whole variety of different scenarios and situations. The approach is currently a targeted one because there is no community transmission at this point. We saw this in effect yesterday, where public health authorities closed a school temporarily where there was confirmation of a case. Public health advice is that schools and early childhood services are safe places for young people to be. The health, safety, and wellbeing of New Zealanders is of upmost importance, and as situations change, we will take action accordingly.

💬 Hon Nikki Kaye: What criteria does the Government have for full or regional closure of schools or other education providers due to COVID-19?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: The protocols that are being implemented at the moment have a number of different escalation points. At the moment, we’re still at the lower level of that, so we’re still looking at cases where children have gone to school where their parents may have been tested positive but they have not displayed any symptoms, or where a student has gone to school who has been displaying symptoms, and in that case it would be the school that is closed. For where there was a series of unrelated cases within a community, of course, the number of school closures would depend on the particular circumstances. Where there was evidence of community transmission within a particular geographical area, then closure of schools within that geographical area may be deemed by those officials to be appropriate, and where there was widespread community transmission throughout the country, then those are the circumstances under which a more widespread school closure would be considered.

💬 Hon Nikki Kaye: Has he considered bringing forward the school holidays as a pre-emptive public health measure to fight COVID-19?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: Yes, we are receiving advice on those sorts of things all of the time. Bringing forward the school holidays early in order to create some breathing space is an option and, if the public health advice is that that’s useful, that’s certainly on the table as one of the options that they can draw on.

💬 Hon Nikki Kaye: What arrangements can he confirm for the capacity for large-scale remote learning, either via online learning or broadcasting, as a result of COVID-19?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: The officials at the Ministry of Education, along with representatives of the telecommunications industry, have been working on a whole variety of different scenarios. There’s a series of issues to be worked through: one is obviously the learning materials and the teaching that goes with those, but then there’s also the capacity. With regards to capacity, that’s going to depend on the circumstances; it’s also going to depend on how many other people may be using the network—people working from home, and so on. So there’s a whole variety of different scenarios being mapped out, and I do want to thank the telecommunications industry for their cooperation here—they’ve been working very constructively with the Government. With regard to remote teaching, we’ve obviously got some additional capacity through Te Kura at the moment where there are isolated cases—for example, where there might be one or two schools that are closed for a period of time, or where students are in self-isolation. Online resources are currently being made available for students who are in self-isolation so they can continue their learning for that period of time. When we get to the point where we are—if we end up—looking at much larger closure, then that’s obviously a much bigger thing to plan for. Scenario planning is taking place for that, should that eventuate.

💬 Hon Nikki Kaye: When is he expecting to announce a further financial support package for education providers to ensure they can deal with the impact of COVID-19?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: There are a number of different variables here. When it comes to schools, schools are relatively well-prepared financially because their funding is very certain—we fund them based on the number of students that they have, and we have a great degree of control over that funding and will keep that money flowing. In early childhood education, I am looking at some of the regulatory settings around funding for early childhood education—for example, where there are a significant number of increased absences, how the funding system may change if that eventuates, because I know, particularly for small early childhood centres, that’s a very real consideration. And also, at the tertiary end of the system, where there are also sort of funding penalties for a variety of different things, we’re looking at those as well to make sure that we are easing pressure where we can where the situation genuinely is beyond an education provider’s control. For private training establishments, for those services where they’ve experienced a significant decline in their business—particularly those dealing with large numbers of international students—there is already support available through the package the Minister of Finance announced earlier in the week. We’ve got some very open dialogue with those parts of the sector as well to see what more we can do to ease some of that pressure.

Question No. 11—Customs

11. to the Minister of Customs: Does she stand by all her statements and actions in relation to COVID-19?

Yes, in the context that they were given.

💬 Simon O’Connor: When she said in her speech yesterday that she expects every person to self-isolate, what precisely is Customs doing to ensure that every single person understands their obligations?

💬 Hon JENNY SALESA: The strict border measures that we have combine customs, health workers at the border, as well as the Ministry for Primary Industries. What Customs is doing is, we have actually changed the customs arrival card so that we include health information on there in terms of self-isolation. This is actually being rolled out later on this evening, and these are some of the questions that are being asked that are different to what has been on that particular form in the past: “Have you been in close contact with a person who’s been diagnosed with COVID-19 in the past 14 days?”; “What date did you have last contact with that person?”; another question, “Have you had any of the following symptoms in the past 14 days: fever, cough, difficulty breathing?”; next question, “Have you been tested for COVID-19?”; next question, “What date were you tested?”; next question, “Have you received results from that test?”; “Was that test positive?”; “Do you intend to self-isolate?”; and, “What address are you going to self-isolate in?” This arrival card is a legal document. False declarations can lead to penalties including fines, prosecution, imprisonment, and deportation from New Zealand.

💬 Simon O’Connor: Acknowledging the Minister’s answer—and thank you—can she confirm to the House, though, that every single returning passenger has at least one person-to-person engagement to specifically outline their health obligations?

💬 Hon JENNY SALESA: I can confirm to the House that what I saw this morning when I went to Auckland international airport was a lot of interaction from different people. So every person who gets off an international plane is stopped by a health person and given a self-isolation card. They then have to fill the card out and then they queue up to two other health folks who then go through the form, either approve it or not approve it—they actually mark it OK or not—then everybody goes on to customs, and it is at the customs booth that folks are then asked again about their self-isolation plans. These forms are then collected, handed to Healthline, and we have the police, who are helping us in terms of spot checks. Those who have filled in their self-isolation plans—police are now going through and doing spot checks to ensure that folks who’ve said they’re self-isolating are indeed self-isolating.

💬 Simon O’Connor: When she says—or has said, rather—that those who refuse to self-isolate may be put on a plane and deported, can she articulate if that is immediately or if that person has to wait in self-isolation in New Zealand first?

💬 Hon JENNY SALESA: Customs actually has powers to detain people at the airport for a certain period of time. Customs is working right alongside our health people at the airport. It is actually advice from health—they are the ones with the power, basically, to deport folks, actually, working alongside immigration. We have all those powers. Customs has powers under the public health Act. It also has powers, and the Minister of Immigration also has powers. It is indeed our intention to enforce all of these different powers to ensure that people who flout the laws, who don’t actually have a plan to self-isolate, do not enter our country, and that they are indeed deported.

💬 Hon Gerry Brownlee: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. The question that was asked is a very important one, and I listened carefully to what the Minister said. She may not have quite picked up what was in that question, and it arises out of the fact that if people aren’t immediately deported and they are kept in New Zealand for their two weeks of isolation, under our current law they’d be entitled to appeal their deportation and therefore stay in the country for a much longer period of time. So I think if the Minister could deal with that—

💬 SPEAKER: Well—[Interruption] I don’t need any help from Iain Lees-Galloway. There’s a general point—saying that one’s not satisfied with an answer is not generally acceptable, but I’ll ignore that and say that I did listen to what the Minister said right at the beginning of her answer. There was a lot of stuff afterwards, but right at the beginning of her answer, she did indicate that there was a power to immediately deport.

💬 Simon O’Connor: What does she say to New Zealanders returning home in recent hours who have not experienced the “strictest border measures in the world”, particularly bearing in mind that they are now through the border and in the community?

💬 Hon JENNY SALESA: What I can say is that everyone who has filled out the form, including their address and, you know, the fact that they say that they will self-isolate—as I say, we are now having the assistance of our police to ensure via spot checks that people are indeed self-isolating. Can I say that fighting COVID-19 is something that we collectively as a society have a responsibility for. The Director-General of Health has already appealed to everyone to dob in people who they know should be self-isolating but are not. This is actually something—in order for us to successfully fight COVID-19, I appeal to all of New Zealand: let’s unite and fight COVID-19.

Question No. 12—Ethnic Communities

12. to the Minister for Ethnic Communities: Does she stand by all her actions and policies for New Zealand’s ethnic communities?

Yes, in the context that they were given.

💬 Melissa Lee: What steps, if any, has the Minister taken to mitigate panic and fear among New Zealand’s ethnic communities regarding COVID-19?

💬 Hon JENNY SALESA: As was covered by the Minister of Health earlier on, we have this big Unite against COVID-19 PR, that has just been delivered as of yesterday. As part of that, the main messages are to be kind, wash and dry your hands, self-isolate, and stay home if you’re sick. That information is also translated into ethnic community languages: Chinese, Indian—you name it.

💬 Melissa Lee: What steps has the Minister taken to promote or distribute information about COVID-19 to Samoans, Tongans, and other Pacific peoples now that we have potentially exported COVID-19 to Samoa?

💬 Hon JENNY SALESA: I’m the Minister for Ethnic Communities; the Minister for Pacific Peoples has responsibility for that question. However, I can say that Unite against COVID-19 is translated to Pacific languages as well.

💬 Michael Wood: Does the Minister stand by her policy of increasing the Ethnic Communities Development Fund, which supports the resilience of ethnic communities, to over $4 million after it had been frozen at $500,000 since 2008?

💬 Hon JENNY SALESA: Absolutely. Our Government has increased the Ethnic Communities Development Fund eightfold, from $520,000 to $4.2 million each year, and it does absolutely assist our ethnic communities on the ground.

💬 Melissa Lee: Is the Minister concerned that statements such as—and I quote—“Our kids are facing bullying at school because of the virus, and the parents are not getting enough information from our Government.” are circulating within New Zealand’s ethnic communities; if so, what efforts is she taking to address those concerns?

💬 Hon JENNY SALESA: One of the things I did last year as Minister for Ethnic Communities was I went around the country and had a consultation to find out what the main issues are that our ethnic communities are facing. Bullying and discrimination and bias were some of those issues that came through loud and clear. We are in the process of addressing that. One of the reasons why we increased the Ethnic Communities Development Fund is because we know that these are issues the community raised with us and we know that they are best at helping the Government to address these issues.

💬 Melissa Lee: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. The Minister actually addressed my question with an answer relating to her work last week. My question was quite specific, relating to bullying because of the virus COVID-19, and she hasn’t actually addressed that.

💬 SPEAKER: Well, I think it’s fair to assume that the general matter of bullying does include specific bullying, and if she says she’s working on that, that addresses the question.

💬 Rt Hon Winston Peters: Can I ask the Minister: in terms of ethnic communities’ interests, is she aware of the amount of money the Government is putting into the Pacific—the Realm countries, Tonga, Samoa, and the wider Pacific—to ensure that we can help those nations through the coronavirus attack that’s happening in our part of the world?

💬 Hon JENNY SALESA: Yes—historic amounts. I also want to remind the House that one of the reasons why we’ve got such strict border measures is to ensure that COVID-19 doesn’t go through as a gateway from New Zealand to the Pacific.