Oranga Tamariki (Repeal of Section 7AA) Amendment Bill

All right, call No. 6—Te Pāti Māori, five minutes.

Tēnā koe e te Pīka. Tēnā tātou katoa e te Whare. I have a five-minute window here, where the coalition Government must listen to me, even if they can’t hear me, and it’s to say this: to object profusely to the shockingly flawed, ignorant, trauma-informed, sanctimonious piece of legislation—it’s a nonsense. Our job, Te Pāti Māori, is to stand and make the points that only we can make, as our job. We relish the responsibility to bring the voice, the aspirations, and the solutions of our whānau mokopuna to this House.

When Dame Whina Cooper said, “Not one more acre.” back in 1975, we saw our people rise to the occasion. We need only reflect on the change her words incited to understand what it means for our people, when, in today’s climate, I say “Not one more mokopuna.” This was the phrase plastered on to posters of all New Zealanders—Māori, Pākehā, tangata Tiriti—held when they ascended from Te Hiku o te Ika, i Te Rerenga Wairua, tae mai ki tēnei pito [the Far North, from Cape Reinga, all the way to this end] on to Parliament grounds in a very peaceful hīkoi. This poster sits on the wall in my office, and next to it another poster, which reads “One third of mokopuna in State care whakapapa to Ngāpuhi.” This reality means that mokopuna nō Te Tai Tokerau are left trying to fight alone in a system that denies the very essence of who they are and who they come from.

This threat is aggravated knowing that without section 7AA, our tamariki will have their Māoritanga severed, despite the Minister saying that there will be cultural components, that there will be cultural elements, as if culture is something you carve up and you compartmentalise, and then you expect that that might be enough culture and custom for the day. This severed line will last generations. What the Minister ignores, or is ignorant to the fact, is that culture is a protective factor. I wish that she knew that and would repeat it and think about that.

This House already knows what severed lines and broken generations look like, because the abuse in care report told us so, really clearly, that when you systematically divest and deprive mokopuna Māori of their culture, you make fodder and victims of our children, of families, of whānau. Dare I say this: the apology made by the Minister of Education that day is already falling short of its promise to never do it again.

For noting, the original intent of section 7AA was to hold Oranga Tamariki, a tragically failing care system—because 14 failed reports told them so—accountable. It demanded that they finally reduce disparities by setting measurable outcomes for tamariki Māori. It was designed to assist and help.

In the removal of section 7AA, the Government sought to persist in the abuse and harm of mokopuna in State care, the theft of generations—an experience that many other indigenous peoples across the globe have endured. Nevertheless, this theft has sparked a new wave of Māori activism. Removing our rights has only united our people. It is our job to serve and to do what is best by our tamariki and mokopuna Māori. Mokopuna Māori are our lifeline. They hold the key for our future as tangata whenua, and while State care continues to threaten their undeniable potential, we know that the return to us will be the right thing to do.

Ngāpuhi paepae at Waitangi turned their back on David Seymour, his party, and everything he stands for. We too, Te Pāti Māori, turn our back on David Seymour, the Minister, and insist that they do the right thing and tear the bill up. Kia ora tātou.

Tēnā koe e te Pīka, he taonga tō tātou nei reo, he taonga ō tātou nei tamariki mokopuna, nō reira taku kauhau i te pō nei, he reo Māori. Kei te tāpiri atu āku nei whakaaro, aku nei kōrero, ki tā tōku tuahine o te Nōta e mea atu, whakanuia ana ōna whakaaro i a Whina Cooper. Kei te mihi tonu ana mātou ki tērā o ngā tauira o te mana motuhake, o te tino rangatiratanga. He mihi anō hoki, me tāpiri atu nei aku mihi ki te maunga e kore e neke, kia whakaaronui tonutia ki a Kōkā Iritana Tāwhiwhirangi, tērā momo i tiaki i a tātou nei tamariki mokopuna, tērā momo i whakapau werawera i whakapau kaha i roto i ngā tau ki te whakarite ngā āhuatanga ki te tiaki i ō tātou tamariki mokopuna. Tērā ngā tau i ngaro noa ana, i ngaro katoa ana i roto i tēnei pire 7AA e takahi ana i runga i Te Tiriti o Waitangi.

Ki a mātou ngā Kākāriki, e ū ana ki te whakaaro he taonga ō tātou nei tamariki mokopuna. He taonga mai i te wā i whānau mai rātou, he taonga anō rātou i te wā i tipu ana rātou. Nō reira ko tēnei mea te whakapapa he taonga. Ko tēnei mea te whanaungatanga he taonga. Me pēnei tātou e tiaki ana i te whakapapa me te whanaungatanga ki roto i ngā momo whare pēnei ana te hanga. Ki roto i ngā āhuatanga o te ture, ki roto i ngā āhuatanga o ngā waeture me ngā kaupapahere e puta ana i ngā Kāwanatanga. Ko te Tiriti o Waitangi anō te take.

I a mātou ngā Kākāriki e whakarongo ana ki ngā kōrero i tau ana ki te komiti whiringa take mō tēnei o ngā pire, i kaha rangona mātou i ngā auē o te iwi, ngā auē o te hapori, ngā auē o te whānau. I kite anō mātou i tērā o ngā wairua ki Waitangi, ki roto i ngā rā kua taha atu. I kite ana te mana nui o Ngāpuhi i a rātou anō i tahuri ō rātou nei tuara ki te Karauna. Me te tūmanako anō, nā te tahuri o ngā tuara ka areare ngā taringa o te Kāwanatanga ki ngā auē o tō tātou nei ao Māori.

I a Kahurangi Carter, tō mātou nei tangata e huri haere ana i te motu, i pērā rawa te āhuatanga o te karere, i pērā rawa te āhuatanga o te wairua. Tē taea te mea atu ko tēnei mea te whakapapa he mea ahurea noa, he mea nā te Māori noa, heoi anō he mea kei reira te hōhonutanga o te Māori. Kei reira te orokohanga o te Māori, tēnei mea te whanaungatanga me te whakapapa. Tērā te take e kaha ana ō tātou hapori ki te wero atu ki tēnei Kāwanatanga, ki te mea atu, nā runga i te mau tonu o Te Tiriti o Waitangi ki roto i ngā pire pēnei ana te āhuatanga, ki roto tonu i tēnei pire, kia noho tonu ai te mana i tāpaehia ki roto i te wāhanga o te ture o te 7AA, ka taea te titiro ki te āhuatanga o te kuhuna o Te Tiriti o Waitangi ki roto i te ngākau o tēnei o ngā ture. Nā te wetewete, nā te tangohia o Te Tiriti o Waitangi mai i tēnei ture, mai i ngā ture pēnei ana te hanga, ka kite ana tātou te ao Māori e kore ana tēnei Kāwanatanga e paku whakarongo, e paku aroha ana ki a tātou anō te Māori. He wero nui tēnā ki te Kāwantanga. He wero nui tēnei ki ngā pātū o tēnei Pāremata.

Nō reira, e mātou hoki e whakarongo ana ki ngā pahupahu a te Minita, kāore mātou e paku whakapono, kāore mātou i te paku whakaaetia, kāore ngā mātanga i paku whakaaetia anō ki a ia hoki, i te mea me mutu ana taku nei kauhau, e pēnei ana te āhuatanga, toitū te taiao, toitū te taiohi, toitū te Tiriti. Tēnā koe e te Pīka.

[Greetings, Mr Speaker. Our language is a treasure, our children and grandchildren are treasures, so my speech tonight will be in the Māori language. I add my thoughts to those of my sister from the North and this is to acknowledge Whina Cooper. We still acknowledge that beacon of self-determination and autonomy. I would also like to add my acknowledgments to the mountain that never moves, and to extend my great respect to Dame Iritana Tāwhiwhirangi, a person of that ilk who cared for our grandchildren, of that ilk who worked tirelessly over many years to ensure the care of our grandchildren. These are the years that I cannot see in this bill on 7AA, that also tramples Te Tiriti o Waitangi.

The Green Party is committed to the idea that our grandchildren are treasures. From the time they were born and on to their upbringing, they are treasures. Genealogy is a treasure, as is kinship. We need to be committed to ensure genealogy and kinship is protected in these types of institutions—in the law, and in the regulations and policies that come out of Government. Again, the Tiriti o Waitangi is important.

As the Greens listened to the discussions that took place in the select committee about this bill, we clearly heard the discontentment of the people, of the communities, and of the families. We also witnessed this same feeling in Waitangi in the last few days. We witnessed the authority of Ngāpuhi when they turned their backs on the Crown. And it is our hope that as a consequence of this act, the Government will heed the pleas of the Māori world.

When our member Kahurangi Carter travelled around the country, that was also the message she received and the mood she felt. We can no longer separate out genealogy as merely a cultural thing, or merely a Māori thing; rather, it is the essence and depth of our being. It is the genesis of Māori—that is, these two things: genealogy and kinship. That is why our communities continue to challenge this Government, to remind them that embedding Te Tiriti o Waitangi in bills such as this, in this bill in particular, ensures that the authority that was granted remains in section 7AA of this law. We can clearly see Te Tiriti o Waitangi in the core of this law. Due to the unbinding and the removal of Te Tiriti o Waitangi from this law and others like it, the Māori world can clearly see that this Government pays no heed and shows no concern to us, the Māori. This is a major issue to this Government. It is a major issue within the walls of this Parliament.

Therefore, and with all of us listening to the ramblings of the Minister, we do not believe at all, we do not agree at all; not even the experts agree. So to end my speech, I would like to say this: uphold the environment, uphold the youth, uphold the Treaty. Thank you, Mr Speaker.]

Thank you very much, Madam Speaker. I rise to speak on the Oranga Tamariki (Repeal of Section 7AA) Amendment Bill. I have chaired the Social Services and Community Committee, which has heard submissions on this bill. I want to acknowledge that we received 3,748 written submissions and heard from 117 submitters in person. I thank all of those submitters for making themselves heard to the committee. Our committee listened carefully to those submitters, and we have recommended by majority a change to the repeal of section 7AA. I want to acknowledge the Minister, who has also listened to those submitters and has indicated there will be a change to the repeal of section 7AA to incorporate a component of it.

Fundamentally, this bill is about making sure that Oranga Tamariki focuses on its primary duties, which is the care and protection of young people—making sure they are safe from harm. I would hope everyone in this House and in this country agrees with that objective. Fundamentally, as a country, I don’t think we should want any of our children to have to come into State care. Ultimately, we want our children to be safe with their families, safe in their communities, but, unfortunately, that is not always the case, and the State does have to step in and help on occasion. That is why we have Oranga Tamariki.

This bill is to just make sure that Oranga Tamariki focuses on that core primary duty: the care and protection of young people. However, we did hear many submitters who expressed concerns about one component in particular, and that was this repeal, removing the obligation on the chief executive to have strategic partnerships with iwi. I note that the bill did not prevent Oranga Tamariki from retaining its current strategic partnerships or from entering into new ones. However, there was concern expressed from a number of submitters that they were concerned it wouldn’t continue without an obligation. The committee heard that, the Minister has clearly heard that, and we have recommended that there be a change to this bill to make sure that this obligation remains in the Act. That is going to happen. Submitters have been heard, and that change is going to happen.

I should note that it was the committee as a majority. The Government members agreed to that change to listen to the submitters, to listen to the request that the obligation remain, and to keep it in the bill. I note that the Opposition members did not recommend that back and did not agree with that. That, I think, needs to be put on the record in this House. That, I think, reflects too the unfortunate weaponisation of this bill to stir up fear in the Māori community across New Zealand about this Government—to create, frankly, misinformation about the objectives of this Government. This is a Government that cares about Māori deeply, that cares about our Māori children deeply, that cares about the future of children. Unfortunately, there has been a lot of misinformation about this. The fundamental core things about this are staying, and yet we’re still hearing speeches telling New Zealand that this is taking away the rights and removing Te Tiriti obligations, etc. Strategic partnerships—the main thing that was raised as a concern, the obligation on the chief executive to maintain strategic partnerships—are going to remain. I really ask: what are the Opposition talking about?

I should mention one other point. There were some concerns raised about reporting obligations. I’ll just run through the reporting obligations that there currently are. There is an annual report, pursuant to the Public Finance Act 1989, which measures performance against standards agreed as part of annual appropriations. Secondly, there is a quarterly report. Thirdly, there’s a Safety of Children in Care annual report. Fourthly, there is a Minister for Children’s report every three years to Parliament in section 44(8)(b) of the Oranga Tamariki Act on whether existing legislation, Government policy, and other accountability documents are meeting the needs of children and young people, particularly tamariki and rangatahi Māori. In addition, there’s an Independent Children’s Monitor, which produces the following reports: (1) a state of Oranga Tamariki system report at least once every three years; (2) an annual report and compliance with national care standards regulations; and (3) an annual report on outcomes for Māori children and young people and their whānau.

It’s not just that. If we look at section 4, there’s no changes to section 4 of the Oranga Tamariki Act—no changes. I note that in subsection (1)(g), this recognises “mana tamaiti (tamariki), whakapapa, and the practice of whanaungatanga for children and young persons who come to the attention of the department:”. Subsection (1)(h) says “maintaining and strengthening the relationship between children and young persons who come to the attention of the department and their—(i) family, whānau, hapū, iwi, and family group; and (ii) siblings:”. That’s still there. That is never going to change. That is not changing.

Again, I ask the Opposition members: what on earth are they telling the people of New Zealand? What on earth are they telling Māori communities across New Zealand? They need to be responsible and be honest about what is happening. This is simply about ensuring that Oranga Tamariki focuses on its primary duties to ensure the safety of children in its care. It is not changing everything else about the importance of connection to their whakapapa, the importance of connection to their family, the importance of connection to their iwi, the importance of connection to their hapū, the importance of strategic partnerships with Oranga Tamariki; so be honest—be honest. I would urge them be honest and don’t strike fear unnecessarily into communities across New Zealand. Be honest with this country. Be honest about what is happening and what we’re doing here.

So, with that, I would say I commend this bill with the amendments that we have recommended by majority—by Government majority—to retain the strategic partnerships as an obligation with iwi. The Government majority has recommended that, and I would commend the bill, on that basis, to the House.

It was very difficult to listen to that last speaker, Joseph Mooney, calling out the Opposition and asking us to be honest. That side of the House and that chair of the Social Services and Community Committee need to be honest, because we sat through over 3,000 submissions, with the vast majority opposing this bill, with Māori organisation, after iwi organisation, after Christian Social Service, after Children’s Commissioner, and many, many credible submitters, telling us that this was the wrong thing to do.

Actually, I think that chair of the committee knew the whole way along that this was the wrong thing to do and felt deeply uncomfortable with the fact that he was forced to do this because of the weak leadership of his Prime Minister and the fact that they signed up to this in a coalition agreement with the ACT Party. Perhaps the chair of the Social Services and Community Committee is the person who needs to be honest about how he feels about this legislation, what we heard from the submitters, the evidence that was put in front of us, and the fact that we were all overwhelmingly presented with a strong case against getting rid of section 7AA.

It is another sad example of the Minister for Children ignoring advice and evidence. That Minister has said on a number of occasions that her primary consideration is the safety and the wellbeing of children in care. No one would argue with that being the primary consideration. I agree with the chair of our select committee that we should—and I believe all do—care about our children and want them to be safe, but, in this particular instance, ideology is overriding the evidence base, and we’re in a position where a decision has been made and we are confronted with legislation that, sadly, does not put the wellbeing of our children first, front, and foremost.

There was an opportunity to actually take some of the “more”, take the components of 7AA and actually put them throughout the legislation in a different way, to ensure that all of that was still included in the legislation. But that wasn’t enough and that certainly wasn’t what the Minister wanted. I think she has a different agenda from her leader of her party. I believe the leader of her party just refuses to acknowledge that anything Māori-specific, anything Māori-informed, anything that Māori say is good for Māori—he refuses to accept that that is true. And where does that get us? Well, that doesn’t take us any further. In fact, it takes us backwards because, for far too long, Māori voices have been ignored when it comes to the wellbeing and welfare of Māori children.

Only at the end of last year were we sitting in this House, all looking and feeling very forlorn and regretful, disgusted in so many ways, about the abuse in State care that has occurred under the watch of consecutive Governments. Then, as Bernie O’Donnell, a submitter, said today in select committee, it’s like Groundhog Day. Here we are again, after an apology’s been made by Government, implementing policies that actually replicate the mistakes that have led to the endangerment, that have led to intergenerational harm and trauma, predominantly for Māori. And here we are doing that again and it actually makes me sad.

We listened to the submissions that came through. It wasn’t just organisations, iwi health providers, social service providers; we had many survivors of abuse speaking to this bill, talking about their experience in State care, talking about the fact that not only had they, in many instances, experienced physical, verbal, psychological, sexual abuse but they had been denied access to what they should have had the right to access their whole lives—that being their whānau, their whakapapa, their reo, and their culture. Here we are, again, taking that away from another generation of children.

Well, how did that serve us, Aotearoa? How did that serve us, every politician in this House, when it was continually done over the course of decades, under the watch and under the approval and sanctioning of this particular Whare? I think that the members that are supporting this bill should be ashamed of themselves—

Joseph Mooney: You’re ashamed of not voting for strategic partnerships. You voted against it.

Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: —for perpetuating the harm that we have only so clearly been informed about—

Joseph Mooney: Who voted against retaining strategic partnerships?

Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: —that we have been clearly told about, that we clearly know about, that was brought about by actions like we are seeing today.

I want to remind that member Joseph Mooney, who continues to interject on my speech, that section 7AA was something that was introduced by a former National Party Minister. It was Anne Tolley that introduced section 7AA. Speaking to my colleague the Hon Willie Jackson, he spoke to me about the fact that Minister Anne Tolley at the time took seriously the insights and experience and intelligence of people like Tariana Turia. She took seriously the evidence that was put in front of her. She paid attention and she included that specific section in the legislation because she was open-minded, because she had the common sense to understand that, actually, it was something that was integral to ensuring the safety of our children moving forward. It made me reflect that, actually, there were a few Ministers under that Key-led Government who weren’t entirely wrong. They did do some good things.

It makes me feel very disappointed with the current Government, particularly the National members, because that legacy of at times working with Māori, honouring Te Tiriti, seems to be something that has been lost under the leadership of Christopher Luxon, because he simply has not been able to stand up to his coalition partners. We oppose this bill—

Joseph Mooney: Oh, you’re surprising us.

Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: —and it doesn’t matter how many times the chairperson of the Social Services and Community Committee yells out that they kept strategic relationships in here as something important. It does not encompass or ensure the full breadth of what was enabled through section 7AA, and that member knows it really well. It is limited. What we will see as a result is our children disadvantaged and our children’s safety and wellbeing put at risk as a result.

We oppose this bill. To the members of the public that may be watching this House, please listen to the speeches but also read the submissions. See the overwhelming evidence for yourselves, see the overwhelming number of people that actually oppose this bill, and the intelligent and informed arguments that they put forward. Don’t just believe us; look at what we were presented with, and then know that the Government members chose to ignore each and every one of those submissions that clearly outlined why the bill should not be supported. We oppose this bill.

Thank you, Madam Speaker. I note from the select committee report that there were a large number of submitters. I note, also, that the committee thanked everyone who submitted for their time and care that they put into their written and oral submissions. They also acknowledged the many submitters who spoke to them from their own personal experience within the care system and thanked them for sharing their stories. I know it would have been a harrowing experience for many. I would also acknowledge all who contributed from both sides of the table.

The safety of our children should always be paramount. As a father of four, my wife and I have strived to provide a loving, nurturing, and safe environment for them. I know that there wouldn’t be a person in the House who doesn’t want the same for their children and for all children in this country—for them to be safe, to be loved, to be cared for, to be nurtured, and ultimately to have opportunities in life. This bill seeks to make sure that those criteria are first and foremost the absolute priority; to enable Oranga Tamariki—the Ministry for Children—to renew its focus on the safety and wellbeing of children in care arrangements.

Every child deserves the same level of care and support based on their individual needs, and their safety and wellbeing put first before other considerations. While this bill repeals references to cultural considerations in section 7AA, it does not remove existing provisions in other parts of the Act that require decision makers to consider cultural factors in care decisions. Thank you, Madam Speaker.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I just wanted to congratulate our deputy leader, Carmel Sepuloni. This is a terrible bill for Māori. I’m listening to Joseph Mooney and it goes against what the National Party believed some years ago. This was a kōrero that was a very deep kōrero with people like Anne Tolley and Bill English, who worked with the Māori Party in terms of getting this up. They got this up because they heard all the horror stories.

Our deputy leader talked about Bernie O’Donnell, for instance, who submitted. Bernie’s one of my closest friends in life. He’s an example of what went wrong in terms of the system. He was moved from family to family to family when he was a kid and then found out his Māori side later on—Tamati was the whānau. But it wasn’t until he found out about his taha Māori side that his life changed.

He comes to the committee knowing that there’s been a history in terms of the National Party having supported what he went through. The sad thing about this is that this is something that the ACT Party have put in place and it’s part of their agenda. That’s what I find particularly sad here, because I know there are very good members on the other side who, at another time, would not support this—they would not support this; they would have supported the John Key strategy.

I have to say—I want to be clear on this, having been at the coalface, having gone in and taken babies from abusive whānau, that te ao Māori used to debate this all the time, too, because in the end, all we want is for those kids to be safe. We’re all agreed on that. But what we realised from everyone we talked to—with all our providers, with all our Māori Party crew, with all our National Party crew, with all our Labour Party crew—was that if we instilled that whakapapa, if we entrenched it in terms of legislation, it would make a difference—it would make a difference. Making it an absolute priority that these babies go to where their whakapapa is, that would make a major change in their lives.

These abused people, these poor souls, one by one—in fact, then we got into the hundreds—told us that, if they only knew where their whakapapa was, if they only knew who their family was, it would have been a huge change in life. But then we get this ACT Party coming in with all these stupid ideas that go against everything that the National Party believed in, and all of a sudden the National Party changes. It is a sad day.

Joseph Mooney: It’s not changing, Willie.

Hon WILLIE JACKSON: You’re changing it, all right, because all our groups are saying that now these kids will get lost in the system. That’s what Carmel Sepuloni is saying. That’s what we’re saying. The dangers are that these kids won’t go to the whakapapa, won’t go to the whānau who they should be with, and they will have a whole loss of identity. That’s what our people are saying, Joseph Mooney. Why don’t you listen to what Māori groups are saying? Why don’t you listen to what iwi are saying? Why don’t you listen to what John Key, Bill English, and Anne Tolley said, that this was exactly the right type of legislation to get in place so that we could turn things around.

I’m proud of what they did in those days. I’m proud of the bipartisan approach that was taken by National, the Māori Party, and Labour at the time. Then all of a sudden it was thrown out because of these idiots on the other side who are attacking Māori things, Māori kaupapa every day, every week. That’s why our former Minister—Willow-Jean Prime—is so offended with what this Minister is doing.

This coalition Government is being led around by David Seymour, who is just playing them all the time and we’re seeing the results of that. They’re being played badly. The result of that is that they’re the most unpopular Government in recent times. No one has seen a Government so far behind in the polls, but I’ve got some advice for the Government: keep doing what you’re doing, because you’re already way behind in the polls and it’s only going to get worse. Keep attacking us, because we’re doing well, and Māori and most of New Zealand are sick of you. Kia ora, Madam Speaker.

Thank you, Madam Speaker. I’d like to acknowledge and thank Minister Karen Chhour for championing this bill—

Hon Willie Jackson: She’s a disgrace, like you.

DEPUTY SPEAKER: No, we won’t make personal attacks, thank you.

Hon Willie Jackson: Oh, it’s too late, Madam Speaker.

DEPUTY SPEAKER: I know, but don’t do it again.

SUZE REDMAYNE: —under particularly harrowing circumstances sometimes, I might add. Even before she became an MP, Minister Chhour was hearing about the unintended—

Hon Willie Jackson: Can’t I say “disgrace”, Madam Speaker?

DEPUTY SPEAKER: Not about a single person. Sorry, can we start the speaker’s time again. Let me make it very clear that you can make comments about the Government and the parties, but don’t make personal attacks about individuals. Thank you.

SUZE REDMAYNE: Even before she became an MP, Minister Chhour was hearing about the unintended consequences of section 7AA of the Oranga Tamariki Act. She saw that the focus on maintaining Māori children’s whakapapa sometimes put young people at risk, because their placements were based on race and not, first and foremost, on their wellbeing, their care, and their protection.

I’d like to take this opportunity to thank the Social Services and Community Committee for their work on the bill. I also want to extend my thanks to all submitters—their input was critical to us getting it right for New Zealand children. While I wasn’t on the select committee, I’ve reviewed the report and I rise today in support of the repeal of section 7AA. The bill represents a necessary step to refocus Oranga Tamariki on its fundamental responsibility: ensuring the safety, stability, and wellbeing of children in their care.

Section 7AA as it stands has led to unintended consequences which compromise the welfare of children that it is aimed at protecting. By repealing section 7AA, Oranga Tamariki (OT) will be free from any conflict between cultural obligations and child welfare decisions. As my colleague Joseph Mooney clearly articulated, this bill does not eliminate cultural considerations, as Opposition members would have you believe. This bill does not remove existing provisions in other parts of the Act which require decision makers to consider cultural factors in care decisions. The bill also retains obligations on the chief executive of OT to develop and maintain strategic partnerships with iwi and Māori organisations, and encourages those organisations to seek out opportunities for partnership.

This repeal reinforces the paramount responsibility of Oranga Tamariki, which must always be ensuring the safety, stability, wellbeing of all children in their care. I commend this bill to the House.

Rapua te huarahi whānui hei ara whakapiri i ngā iwi e rua i runga i te whakaaro kotahi. [Pursue the wider path as a way of bringing two peoples together in one thought.] Tonight I rise to speak on the Oranga Tamariki (Repeal of Section 7AA) Amendment Bill, and I acknowledge the heaviness, the taumahatanga of the kaupapa [the burden of the topic] that is before this House this evening. Tēnei te mihi ki ngā iwi mōrehu e mihi ana ki a koutou mō tō kaha i te kaupapa nei, kia kaha tonu. [I acknowledge the survivors for your strength in this issue: continue to be strong.]

Along with others in this House, we acknowledged the apology to 250,000 survivors of abuse in State care, not so long ago. That was a heavy afternoon, where everyone in this House acknowledged what had gone on, and the terrible history of Aotearoa New Zealand; nothing that anyone in this House is proud of. But this Government is dark. The darkness that they have cloaked over Māori—

Joseph Mooney: You’re driving out of fear, Shanan. You’re driving fear unnecessarily. It’s wrong. You know it’s wrong.

SHANAN HALBERT: —over that apology; the day that they supported boot camps, against all the evidence and again today, Joseph Mooney, as you speak in support of this bill.

Let’s be frank, the political landscape has changed; it’s not the same as it was two years ago when these guys instilled fear across the country that Māori were getting too much. The political landscape has changed, and the ACT Party is digging National’s grave. This is another example. For those of us who were at Waitangi—the Prime Minister wasn’t—we heard very clearly that not only just Māori but New Zealand does not support the actions of this country.

Joseph Mooney: Tell us about the bill.

SHANAN HALBERT: New Zealand doesn’t support 7AA, Joseph Mooney.

Joseph Mooney: Tell us about the bill, Shanan.

DEPUTY SPEAKER: He just did; he said 7AA.

SHANAN HALBERT: You’ve already had a big night, Joseph. You might need to cut it short, my friend.

DEPUTY SPEAKER: Back to the bill.

SHANAN HALBERT: What Government comes into place to create worse outcomes for New Zealanders? What Government does that? The evidence that is before the select committee, no matter who you’re hearing from, says that there’s not enough evidence to support this change. It is politically motivated, but the landscape has changed. The Waitangi Tribunal found clear breaches of Treaty article 2. The whakataukī that I started my kōrero with tonight talked about Treaty partnership; it talked about tino rangatiratanga.

Joseph Mooney: Have you read article 2?

SHANAN HALBERT: Do you know about tino rangatiratanga?

Joseph Mooney: Yes; have you read article 2?

SHANAN HALBERT: Because you are not enabling it under this bill, Joseph Mooney.

Joseph Mooney: Have you read article 2 of the Oranga Tamariki Act?

SHANAN HALBERT: As I said, he’s had a big night. If we look at the regulatory impact statement, it says there’s a lack of robust evidence to support the view that section 7AA causes harmful changes to long-term care arrangements. The question before us today—and those that sat in front of te iwi mōrehu on that day of the apology—why are we doing this? It can only be politically motivated.

My friend Tu Chapman puts it well in a few of her posts. She does a number, but she talks about the connection of being Māori, the protection of that under Te Tiriti and tino rangatiratanga—

Joseph Mooney: And article 2 of the Act.

SHANAN HALBERT: —but the extension of that to takatāpuitanga—

Joseph Mooney: And strategic partnerships with iwi.

SHANAN HALBERT: Takatāpuitanga; do you know what takatāpuitanga is? I read the submission from Te Ngākau Kahukura, and I hope that the Government, and Joseph Mooney, the chair, in particular—because he’s not going well—listen to some of the contribution of this particular submission, to the words of Moana Jackson, who talks about the “Experiences of alienation, abuse and mistreatment of takatāpui have been a feature of the state care system since its establishment as an instrument of the colonial government. In 2019, … Moana … presented findings from He Whaipaanga Hou - A New Approach to the Royal Commission of Inquiry into Abuse in [State] Care. His statement included an acknowledgement of historical abuse experienced by takatāpui in state care: ‘I would also like to add that among those 600, were 44 who identified as Takatāpui, gay or transgender. Over half of those were also placed in care and all of those Takatāpui were abused in care as children. Their treatment or mistreatment in care was part of their almost inevitable progression into prison. Many of them are still comparatively young and suffered abuse in institutions after 1999.’ ”

That is some serious stuff in front of us. The problem with this—and I heard the chair speak and talk about how this doesn’t eliminate the current arrangements that are in place. The problem is it doesn’t enable them—it doesn’t enable them. That’s exactly the reason why this bill was introduced.

Joseph Mooney: Try reading the report. Maybe that’s the problem. You don’t actually understand what you’re talking about. Try reading it.

SHANAN HALBERT: You are not able to put a guarantee on the table, Joseph Mooney, that Māori cultural needs of tamariki o takatāpui will be taken care of in the system. You cannot provide that guarantee—you cannot offer that guarantee.

Joseph Mooney: As a lawmaker, you should read the Act.

SHANAN HALBERT: The ignorance and arrogance of that side and that chair tonight is off the charts. It is unbelievable. Shameful.

I look at the Māori members in this House, including the Minister, and her disgraceful actions, those that sit on—

DEPUTY SPEAKER: Just be careful. You did mention “the Minister”, just be careful that this doesn’t get personal, OK? You’re fine so far; I’m just keeping it up there.

SHANAN HALBERT: Yep, members that sit alongside myself, the chair of our Māori Affairs Committee, he’s going to support that tonight; the Minister for the South Island. There was a member here that used to be our chair on Māori affairs but has bailed. I mention that because it’s important that these people, these members of Parliament, are held accountable for their actions.

This is not good legislation. This is not what New Zealanders are asking for; they’re asking for cost of living respite. They’re asking for you to focus on the things that matter, not on the things that are politically motivated by the ACT Party who is wagging your tail—the tail of this Government.

Joseph Mooney: Have a go at reading the Act.

SHANAN HALBERT: Joseph Mooney, if I played as many of your terrible speeches in this House across your time, you would be highly embarrassed, so stop heckling across that side. You’re a disgrace. You’re letting us down on behalf of this Government.

DEPUTY SPEAKER: No, no. Stop, stop. That was a personal attack. Stick to the bill.

Hon Carmel Sepuloni: Point of order, Madam Speaker. The point I just want to raise, and I didn’t want to interrupt the speech, is that there is a convention and a rule that interjections need to be rare and reasonable. However—

Hon Members: Ha, ha!

Hon Carmel Sepuloni: I’m doing a point of order, Madam Speaker.

DEPUTY SPEAKER: Yeah, silence during points of order. Thank you.

Hon Carmel Sepuloni: Madam Speaker, it has been more like a conversation from the other side of the House, at times, and it has been consistent throughout the course of this speech, and, I think, in many ways, that’s probably the reason it led to the unfortunate comment made by the speaker on our side. I do want to make the point that, actually, the level of interjection from one particular member on that side of the House is not fitting within the Standing Orders of this House.

Joseph Mooney: Speaking to the point of order, Madam Speaker. I have certainly, personally, I would suggest, made some rare interjections suggesting that the member read the Act.

DEPUTY SPEAKER: Yeah, so, look—just hold on a moment before the member starts speaking again—this has been a very emotional and contentious debate. So far, we’ve been able to keep it up. I agree there have been a lot of interjections from both sides. Yes, we’ve had quite a lot in this recent speech from on my right-hand side. I’ve been very lenient with some of the comments that have gone back and forward between each other but I’m not going to allow personal attacks, saying that a person is a disgrace. Some of the other things that have been going backwards and forwards, it’s just a heightened part of this debate, but can we keep it so that we’re not taking it to a personal level. I accept interjections are one thing, but the member makes a good point—just keep them to interjections and not a barrage.

SHANAN HALBERT: Thank you, Madam Speaker. My apologies. And apologies to Joseph Mooney. If he wants to peer review each other’s speeches in future, I’m happy to do that!

DEPUTY SPEAKER: It’s a kind offer.

SHANAN HALBERT: Just in my closing remarks tonight, I did want to acknowledge not just te iwi mōrehu but our takatāpui community who will be impacted by the decisions of this Government as this piece of legislation moves forward. We know that Māori are well represented in statistics in State care. We know that Oranga Tamariki doesn’t have the right cultural practices in place; they need to continuously be strengthened, but, alongside that, we need to ensure that it reflects the needs of takatāpui. That’s why I’m standing here tonight in this very heavy and difficult debate. Tēnā tātou.

Thank you, Madam Speaker. I just want to acknowledge that, on both sides of the House, this has been very passionate, and, obviously, it’s going to be one of those things that we agree to disagree on. I just want to acknowledge the emotion and the passion, which, ultimately, is for our children, our tamariki.

The purpose of the second reading is to really reflect that of the Social Services and Community Committee—and the important thing, I think, to recognise is that the select committee in this instance has served its purpose. With over 3,000 submissions, there have been some considerations and some amendments made. In particular, the strategic partnership is an obligation, and that’s a key theme. I’ll just read out from the amended bill new section 7(2)(i), in clause 4A, for example: “(i) consider and respond to any invitation from 1 or more iwi or Māori organisations to enter into a strategic partnership in accordance with paragraph (h) and subsection (7).”

This has been a reflection deeply considered and, ultimately, this is child-centric, and although we might disagree on some of the process and some of the implications, we can all agree that we need to look after our children. While this bill repeals the references to cultural considerations contained in section 7AA, it does not remove existing provisions in other parts of the Act that require decision makers to consider cultural factors in care decisions. The wellbeing of children must come first—their immediate safety, stability, and wellbeing—and for those reasons, we will be supporting the bill.

The question is, That the amendments recommended by the Social Services and Community Committee by majority be agreed to.

Amendments agreed to.