Arms (Licence Holders’ Applications for New Licences) Amendment Bill

I move, That the Arms (Licence Holders’ Applications for New Licences) Amendment Bill be now read a third time.

Law-abiding firearms owners shouldn’t be affected by firearms licence - processing delays. It is the aim of this bill to ensure that law-abiding citizens can continue to legally use and possess firearms. The scope of this bill is quite a tight one. It’s designed to ensure that this matter can be dealt with as quickly as possible. I do want to thank members across the House for their goodwill in helping to facilitate the speedy passage of this bill. I do acknowledge that the select committee process was therefore a very truncated one. Some firearms licence holders have already been affected, because their licence has expired and they’ve been waiting for a new licence to be approved. In the meantime, they find themselves potentially unlawfully possessing firearms. That is an unacceptable situation. They should not be placed in that situation, and this bill will remedy that matter.

The number of licence holders in this situation is going to continue to grow as we reach the 10-year peak, caused, of course, by the decision taken by this House in 1992 to do away with lifetime firearms licences and move to 10-year licences. These 10-year peaks are not new. They have occurred regularly, and this bill will, hopefully, bring that matter to a close, and this will be the last time we have to go through this experience.

There are, of course, some additional challenges that do make the Police’s job more difficult in that regard. There is increased scrutiny required for licence applications, following the royal commission of inquiry into the terrorist attack on the Christchurch mosques. And, of course, they’ve also been dealing with the impacts of COVID-19 - related delays because of lockdowns and the like.

The Police have been making operational changes to ensure that they’re processing licences as quickly and expeditiously as they can. However, that alone will not be sufficient to ensure that more firearms licence holders are not placed in the situation where they, effectively, are unable to comply. So this bill deals with the issue by ensuring that they all continue to be legal in their possession of firearms, even whilst they’re waiting for their new licence to be approved.

Finally, there is a technical matter, which is that the bill allows for electronic notices to be issued electronically. I’m going to go through this in detail, because I know it’s been an issue that has been discussed. The current Arms Act does enable electronic notices to be issued through the registry, but this needed to be expanded to enable electronic notices directly to an email address. An amendment was made during the select committee to ensure that this is delivered to an electronic email address that the recipient has agreed to use as the address for service. The bill will improve efficiencies for licence holders, range operators, and the police by enabling these notices to be issued using electronic means. A number of people in the community do prefer that, and, of course, there are challenges even with traditional mail. Those challenges are only going to continue to grow as traditional mail becomes less and less frequent and as we become more and more used to not using it any more. People don’t empty their letterboxes every day in the way they used to, and there are going to be challenges either way. Electronic means of communication is the way of the present and the way of the future, and so we do need to allow for that to be used more broadly in this context.

Again, I want to thank the select committee for its very speedy consideration of the bill, and I want to thank the House for the goodwill that has been shown in ensuring that this bill can pass through its remaining stages quickly.

The question is that the motion be agreed to.

Thank you, Mr Speaker. Look, firstly, can I acknowledge the Minister of Police, the chair of the Justice Committee, and the other committee members. We all worked on this as quickly as we could because we clearly understood that we had good, law-abiding Kiwis from a very strong law-abiding community, our firearms community, that were put in the awful position that they were breaking the law because they were engaging in a process in good faith. The process was not able to support their application and so it was needed—unfortunately, because, in actual fact, it’s not good practice to have to pass legislation to try and fix a process. But the Minister has outlined some of the challenges in relation to that process, and we accept that. Therefore, it was a very easy decision to get behind the Government and to make sure that we expedited this through the committee.

Can I acknowledge the advisers. I think the advisers’ advice and skills and hard work on this bill were on display for us tonight with the great advice that we received through committee stage. Just finally, can I acknowledge the Minister’s response to Nicole McKee in the committee stage when she raised the issue around delivering of documents and, for example, an improvement notice through electronic means. I think that was a very important issue to raise because we all know—and the Hon Damien O’Connor highlighted and raised during his contribution that he has actually got a pistol club at his shooting club. They provide land on their farm for the club to be able to participate and go there and engage in their chosen sport. But probably most of them are farmers. They are volunteers. They don’t necessarily have paid officers in the clubs, and emails may sit in the inbox for a while and may not be checked in. So the 28-day expiry actually matters and it does count.

I think that it was very important for the Minister to put on the record clearly and say that the intent of the bill is not to be punitive. The police intend to work with the community, with the clubs, to make sure that there are no perverse outcomes. I think that’s very important because I want to acknowledge the work that the police do in terms of their job as the regulator, but I also want to remind them that it’s critically important that they have a strong, trusted relationship with our firearms community. That is the best way that legislation under the Arms Act is going to work for us as a country. So it’s incumbent upon the police not just to be a good regulator and make sure that our laws are followed but that they also engage in a very positive way with our firearms community to make sure there’s high levels of compliance and with goodwill from everyone. So thank you very much, Mr Speaker.

The firearms community has been understandably concerned about the impact on their lawful status and shooting activities if their licence expires prior to the police deciding on their application for a new licence. The delays have had a direct impact on those who need licences for their work or for their business. It has also placed those with collections of pistols, prohibited firearms, and restricted weapons in a position where they must continue to hold their collections unlawfully, as alternative storage arrangements may not be readily available.

It’s good to see that this bill is going to reach its third reading, and so quickly. We worked hard on the Justice Committee to make sure we brought it back to the House as quickly as possible, and it’s good to see it here tonight, passing with support from all parties.

After the bill is passed, the police will be able to implement an intelligence-based triaging system to prioritise licence applications that require further investigation. This will help police to flatten the peaks in demand and processes that licence applications have come in in a far more sustainable manner. This is also known as the targeted renewal approach.

I look forward to this legislation passing into law and making this area work far more smoothly for those people who need it. I commend it to the House.

Thank you, Mr Speaker. Pleasure to take a call here at the final reading, now, of the Arms (Licence Holders’ Applications for New Licences) Amendment Bill. I think we’ve traversed it pretty well over the last hour or so, with the committee of the whole House and the second reading immediately prior to that. I would just reiterate that this is not great legislation-making process, in terms of pushing this through under urgency, but, as my colleagues have mentioned, and myself in my second reading speech, this needs to happen. It’s impacting law-abiding New Zealanders without appropriate reason. It’s unfortunate that it has taken as long as it has, but we are here now, we do support it, and it will be a practical change. So, on that basis, I commend this bill to the House.

Thank you, Mr Speaker, for the opportunity to take a brief call in relation to the Arms (Licence Holders’ Applications for New Licences) Amendment Bill. I’d just like to thank the Minister at committee stage for responding to some really practical and useful questions that were put by the floor and, once again, to thank Nicole McKee for her guidance during the select committee process, but also for some very practical operational questions that I think were usefully put to the floor at committee stage. They actually echoed some of the practical questions that were put to us during the select committee, including one on the online register, put to us by the New Zealand Antique and Historical Arms Association.

So, once again, I think we’ve had a really robust process, a really collegial process across the Justice Committee, and I commend this bill to the House.

Kia ora. I rise in support of the Arms (Licence Holders’ Applications for New Licences) Amendment Bill. I wish to thank the Justice Committee and officials. I know that we bring different skills to this House, so I’m pleased about the expertise that my colleague Nicole McKee was able to bring to this committee—we don’t often get to shine in all of the areas that we’re good at when we come into this place—and I think her nickname as the “Gun Lady” will be set for a very long time.

I acknowledge those who are affected by this. Were he still with us, that would have included my father and many, many people who live in rural areas who don't always have access to computers, to the internet. He certainly wouldn't be happy with officials mucking around with his business.

Thanks to those who submitted at extreme short notice. However, this is still one of the few bills that we’ve considered over these few days that even have had that much of a chance for our communities, our constituents, and the people affected to have a say in the legislation that they’re going to be bound by, moving forward.

Also, urgency—we did not support it. It seems unnecessary for a bill which is literally to cause delays and to actually compensate for quite a significant delay that’s been created—because this entire bill seems to me to be a workaround. The fact is that something which was entirely predictable, something completely preventable—enough resource wasn’t allocated to it, enough planning wasn’t done to sort it out—has to come to this House to be tidied up so that staff are not breaking their own laws for not doing their own job. We need to make sure that the people who are doing these have the resource to do it and then we wouldn’t have to be considering this kind of law in such a short time frame.

All the best to those of you who are going to be gritting your teeth through some of this process as you get your licence renewed, but, in the meantime, let’s get on with this. We commend this bill to the House.

Thank you, Mr Speaker. On this, the third reading of another urgent bill that’s going through, that will actually benefit firearm licence owners for a change—a nice surprise after three years of being slammed—this is something that the ACT Party can and will support.

I’d like to start off by thanking the Minister of Police for the work that he has done in this area. After many years of trying to advocate for a change, for a positive for the community, we feel that he has finally listened, or the Government has finally listened, and actually come up with practical solutions for the firearms community, especially for those hunters out there as we head into Christmas and they’re wanting to go out and put some fresh, lean venison or wild pork on the Christmas table; they’ll actually be able to do it after 29 November. And 29 November is the day that the officials have just told us in the House that the online checker will be available. It’ll be after Royal assent, but it means that those invalid licences will become valid again just in time for December.

It’s also about—while this has been under urgency, what we’ve also had in the past is changes in law that have come about or submissions on regulations which have come about either during the Christmas holidays or specifically during the roar or duck-shooting seasons when people are not even available or anywhere near their computers—they’re outdoors doing it. They will not have that problem this time round, because it’s sorted before we even get to Christmas.

And what is sorted here is the clarification—the clarification around what this licensing bill means to those with expired licences. To answer so many of those emails and questions that I have received, we have had it confirmed that retrospectivity will apply in this case, so where firearm licences have expired but were applied for before they expired, this bill means that they, from 29 November, will be able to have access to their firearms. So it’s not only from 29 November onwards; it actually incorporates those that have been caught up in the past.

A new Part 3 of Schedule 1 was placed into the bill, which actually came about because of a submitter questioning around the COVID extensions that were given back in 2020 and 2021. This meant that those with expired licences during the lockdown period were given order—

💬 DEPUTY SPEAKER: Just, members on my left, I’m struggling to hear the speaker. Could you just keep it down a little bit, please. Thank you—carry on.

Thank you. Those with expired licences that expired during the COVID lockdown were given extensions at that time, but we actually had to write in a whole new Part 3 to allow them to be included in this retrospectivity piece of the legislation. I think that actually goes to speak to how long some people have been waiting to have their licences renewed, when back in 2020 and 2021, during COVID lockdown, they were given an extension and we need to now put a whole new part in the legislation to ensure they too are included. So I think that will be a bit of a relief to many out there.

So retrospective is for licence holders; it’s also for dealers, and further to that, it’s for those who have endorsements on their licences as well—so those who have had to take pistols, for example, and give them to another endorsed holder to hold on to will be able to get those pistols back and they will be able to use them. What the clubs and ranges, or the clubs and people operating the ranges, need to be aware of is the fact that they need to check the licences as being valid if they are presented with one that has expired. That’s going to take a lot of education from police and other organisations, such as those parent sporting club organisations, to get the message out to the community on what their new requirements are.

The Police talked about triaging and prioritising those that they will put through the system—who will be first and who will be last. I’d just like to assure the community that if you don’t hear from police, it’s because you’ve been triaged as being a responsible, fit and proper person. Those who do hear from police rather quickly may like to think that perhaps there is something about what they have done or behaved or, perhaps, posted online that might be of concern. So there will definitely be two classes here: ones that are already seen as not being an issue and may have to wait a little bit longer than those who police are a little bit worried about and want to investigate and therefore may get a call quicker. At the end of the day, if we can make sure that the licences are processed within the 90-day key performance indicator that Police have set for themselves—which, I will add, has expanded from 30 days to 60 days and now it’s on 90 days—if Police can get to that regime, then we won’t know who’s been triaged as being good and who’s been triaged as being of concern. But we need to get to that 90 days—not 12 months, not 24 months.

We also need to ensure that those with their pistol endorsements are able to participate in what they’re legally obliged to do, which is attend at a pistol club 12 times a year. It’s hard to do that if you don’t have the licence. It’s even harder to do that if the club are unable to check the validity of that licence.

The other thing I’d like to just talk about when we discuss progressing into the technological age that we are becoming, it’s around the email side, which I know I’ve brought up a couple of times, but there was just recently a debate in this House by the Citizens Advice Bureau. They asked us to look at the digital age and about the people who have access to digital communications. While I understand that we need to progress and we need to move forward, we also need to make sure we take everybody along with us, and I recall this evening that I got a list from the Citizens Advice Bureau about the number of people who do not have access to online. This means they won’t have access to email, and this also means that they won’t have access to the information about what changes have been made and what obligations there are. So I do hope that the New Zealand Police make a really good effort at getting in touch with the 240,000 licensed firearm owners around New Zealand to tell them not only this good news that has happened but how they can ensure that they comply, especially from 29 November. I’m sticking to that date—it’s before Christmas, it’s before December, and it’s the time when those fit and proper people can get their firearms back.

This has been quite big for a lot of people, including those that are holding firearms for others. This has meant in some cases that people who are trying to help a mate out have actually had problems with their insurance cover. Insurance organisations have gone back to people and said, “We don’t want to insure you for these extra firearms, or, if we do, it’s going to cost you a lot more money.” What we see now is that people can take control back of their own property and make sure that they are able to continue on in a fit and proper way with the sport, with the career, with the pest control that they do using firearms.

The other thing is about pest control. Knowing that the endorsements are going to continue on means that many of those that are unable to take care of the pests which have got well out of control, because of the legislative changes of 2020, can now be managed because their expired licences will continue.

And as a last little mention there, it would be great if dealers did not have to renew their licences every 12 months. It’s been a bane for them for quite a number of years, and really very unnecessary. There’s not a huge amount of them, but what they will be grateful for is the ability to continue on business and supply those legitimate, fit and proper licence owners with what they need to continue with their sports and their business.

I’d like to thank everyone across the House: finally, we’ve got something positive in the arms section. Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Tēnā koe, Mr Speaker. Ngā mihi o te raumati e haramai nei ki a koe.

[Best wishes to you for the summer ahead.]

This is my first call on this bill, but it has been a pleasure to sit on the Justice Committee, which has considered it. May I start with thanks to the submitters who came to the committee and brought their knowledge and their passion for this area, and to colleagues around that committee, particularly Nicole McKee, who has been acknowledged around the House tonight as an expert in this area. Her expertise on this bill was very useful for all of the committee, and if that member wishes to engage in some pest control and bring some venison to the committee, then I’m sure that would be warmly received and we would congratulate her for her excellent service to the environment!

I have one point to make: this is a good bill because it fixes a problem that will arise soon. Police anticipate that demand for new licences is about to increase rapidly. This will allow the agency to deal with this problem in a way which helps firearms owners and the agency to do this in a timely way, and that’s why I commend it to the House.

Motion agreed to.

Bill read a third time.

I declare the House in committee for consideration of the Companies (Levies) Amendment Bill.