Oversight of Oranga Tamariki System and Children and Young People’s Commission Bill

Members, the House is in committee for further consideration of the Oversight of Oranga Tamariki System and Children and Young People’s Commission Bill. I’ll remind members that they’re able to participate remotely. If you’re on Zoom and want to take a call, please type “call” into the chat. You should also use the chat if you want to raise a point of order. If we receive new tabled amendments, I’ll advise members so that they can refresh the House papers page to see the new amendment. Finally, it would be helpful for members to ask multiple questions, if they have them, of the member in charge during the call. When we were last debating the bill, we were debating clauses 1 and 2 and new clause 2A. The question is that—

Tim van de Molen: Mr Speaker?

💬 Dr Duncan Webb: Point of order. I couldn’t help but notice that you’d started the vote. It wouldn’t be appropriate to take the call.

Tim van de Molen: The Standing Orders are quite clear that anyone can seek the call up until the point that you put the vote, and you had only started posing the question. So we’re not indeed seeking the vote at that point.

CHAIRPERSON (Greg O’Connor): Yes, the member is correct. I hadn’t actually put the question. So I’ll give the Hon Scott Simpson the call.

Well, thank you, Mr Chair. The bill that we’re considering—we’ve come pretty much to the end of the committee stage, but we’re at the point where we are, I think, unless I’ve got it wrong, discussing matters relating to the title and commencement. One of the issues that I would like to ask the Minister in the chair, the Hon Carmel Sepuloni, is about the title of the bill. It’s pretty innocuous, and I’m just wondering whether the Minister might be able to give us some information as to the detail as to what advice she received from officials on the particular wording of the bill, and why the word “oversight” was used when, actually, many people—laypeople who watch the proceedings relating to this agency—would think that often it’s a matter of “undersight” rather than oversight. If the Minister could give me some kind of insight into the reason for the use of “oversight” rather than “undersight”, I’d appreciate it.

I move, That the question be now put.

Thank you, Mr Chair, and I apologise for my tardiness. In terms of addressing the committee and speaking to the title and the commencement, I understand my colleague Karen Chhour has spoken to her Supplementary Order Paper in relation to that. Again, I impress to the Minister the importance of the relevance and the significance that, in terms of the commencement of this bill, the priority and the emphasis and the public opinion that’s come through is that this should not be proceeding. So commencement is something that is not factoring in the minds, in the supportive mode of our New Zealand community.

The commencement as is stated in the bill is for this to come into force on the earlier of the following: a date appointed by the Governor-General by Order in Council—interestingly, a former Commissioner for Children, our Governor-General, who will be signing off on this when it does come before her—or 1 July 2023, next year. So insofar as commencement, the submission is, and the proposal is, that this not commence until at least six months after the report back from the royal commission of inquiry into those who have been abused in State care.

So in speaking to clause 2, the commencement, it’s really the proposition and the public opinion that there be a deferment rather than commencement, taking into account—and that this Government should accordingly do so—heed and recognise the relevance and significance of the royal commission of inquiry and the lived experience of those who have been abused in State ill-care, welfare, State care.

So with the remaining minutes and moments that are left on this, in addressing the commencement, seeking a deferment which takes into account public opinion rather than Government convenience and expediency, and that, in concluding—not that it’s going to happen, but certainly getting it out in the public domain and on the record for the benefit of the public who have been supportive of this all the way along. This bill should not be proceeding. It should not be commencing as of 1 July 2023 or an earlier date appointed by the Governor-General. This is flawed legislation to be, and that, in talking to the title, I said that this really should be about how blind this Government is, how deaf this Government is, in saying that this is an oversight with the wraparound of three entities to provide that for our people who’ve been experienced in State care—welfare, ill-care. This is an absolute dismissal, an overlooking of the concerns and the regards of those who have experienced, to their detriment, what the Government has previously done and is striving to do so now with this commencement, if it’s signed off.

I move, That the question be now put.

The question is that the Minister’s amendment to clause 2 set out on Supplementary Order Paper 209 be agreed to.

The question is that Karen Chhour’s amendment inserting new clause 2A set out on Supplementary Order Paper 189 be agreed to.

I move Supplementary Order Paper 210 dividing the bill.

The committee has further considered the Oversight of Oranga Tamariki System and Children and Young People’s Commission Bill and reports it with amendment and divided into the following bills: Oversight of Oranga Tamariki System Bill and Children and Young People’s Commission Bill. I move, That the report be adopted.

Motion agreed to.

Report adopted.