Oral Questions

1. to the Minister of Finance: What recent reports has he seen on the New Zealand economy?

The jobs market is working for young people. Stats New Zealand’s employment indicators for June show that by age group, the largest increase in the number of filled jobs was in the 15- to 19-year age group, up 16.9 percent in the year ended June 2022. As measured by the Household Labour Force Survey in the June quarter, the unadjusted number of young people aged 15 to 19 who were in employment increased by 13,500, or 11.1 percent over the year. The investment that this Government is making in skills and training through programmes like Mana in Mahi, Flexi-wage, and He Poutama Rangatahi, as well as the initiatives to reduce barriers to help New Zealanders, for example, obtain their drivers’ licences, is supporting young people into work and improving their employment outcomes.

💬 Helen White: What other reports has he seen on the economy?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: Well, Stats New Zealand reported today that the number of overseas visitors to New Zealand shores rose in June to the highest level since March 2020 when COVID-19 travel and border restrictions were put in place. The number of travellers more than doubled to 94,600 in the June month, compared to the same month a year ago. Those from Australia led the way, making up 74 percent of all overseas arrivals. Those arriving here to visit friends and relatives made up 52 percent; those on holiday, 30 percent; and those on businesses trips, 12 percent. On an annual basis, overseas visitor arrivals were up significantly on the June 2021 year. We know that sectors such as tourism and hospitality have been heavily impacted by the pandemic, and the opening of the border and the prospect of a strong tourism season this summer will provide opportunities to rebuild and support the recovery of the economy.

💬 Helen White: What reports has he seen on initiatives to build a more sustainable and resilient economy?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: The Government is developing eight industry transformation plans that have the purpose of building a high-wage, low-emissions economy. Yesterday, the Government set out a vision for one of those in tourism, with the Tourism Industry Transformation Plan, which will support the sector to rebuild better, with a stronger focus on a more resilient and regenerative future. The plan was developed in partnership with the industry, with unions, with Māori, and is now open for public consultation. It does identify challenges, but also sets out actions to overcome perceptions of the tourism industry as being one with low wages, long hours, and uncertainty. Our response to this includes improving education and training, providing more resources for business owners and operators, and enabling better work through innovation and technology. We have supported the tourism sector throughout the pandemic, including the $49 million Tourism Kick-start Fund, to help operators gear up for the return of international visitors, and we will continue to work closely with the industry to ensure its long-term sustainability.

Question No. 2—Finance

2. to the Minister of Finance: On what date did he first request advice for the Government’s support for New Zealanders by way of a targeted and temporary cost of living payment, and what warning, if any, did officials give him about potential problems with this proposal?

As far back as November 2021, when the Government announced increases to the Working for Families tax credits as part of the package of support to come into effect from 1 April, we were aware of the need to provide targeted support to New Zealanders for the cost of living increases that they were facing. We followed this up with reductions to fuel excise, road-user charges, and public transport fares that were announced on 14 March. I formally requested advice on further support for low and middle income New Zealanders not receiving the winter energy payment on 21 March. Implementing an action like this in response to a cost of living crisis was not something that had been done previously in New Zealand. Officials indicated that there could be a range of issues with such a payment, as has been released within the regulatory impact statement. Officials then went on to determine how to best work through those issues and deliver the payment in a timely way during a crisis period. I stand by our actions to put in place measures to support New Zealanders during this period of time and, in fact, note that members of the Opposition were themselves calling for such measures. We just found ones that were better than $2 a week for someone on the minimum wage.

💬 Nicola Willis: Is it a coincidence that he first sought advice on the cost of living payment on 21 March, just one week after the Prime Minister finally admitted that there was a cost of living crisis?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: I think the member needs to be careful with her conspiracy theories on the other side of the House. What I would say to the member, as I said in my primary answer, is that from November, the Government was focused on what we could do to support New Zealanders through the cost of living pressures they were facing, and, indeed, I’m surprised that the member didn’t choose the intervention of one Nicola Willis on 16 March, who called for people in the squeezed middle—people earning between $60,000 and $70,000—to get some extra support. So perhaps the member, rather than that conspiracy theory, might want to put herself at the centre of it.

💬 Nicola Willis: Why did the Minister insist on going ahead with this payment, when his own officials warned against “progressing such a significant policy in accelerated timeframes” as there are “significant risks associated with designing this proposal at speed”?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: I know this will come as a shock to the member, but from time to time, Governments disagree with the Treasury. It’s hard to believe, but it does happen, and, in fact, the member might want to reflect back on some of the occasions that it occurred for her party. On this side of the House, we faced up to the fact that people were facing—as the member called on us to do—a cost of living crisis, and we designed in that period of time something to reach a group of New Zealanders who had not been supported by actions on 1 April. I stand by that action.

💬 Nicola Willis: Did it come as a shock to the Minister to learn that a quarter of the money on the cost of living payment has gone to the top 30 percent of households, and that’s before you count expats in London and French backpackers?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: The information about the distribution of the payment was, in fact, contained in the advice that we got in the Cabinet paper that went to Cabinet, so that is not a revelation to me. However, the member would find it perhaps a revelation to know that had her policy been implemented, those on the highest incomes would have been getting thousands of dollars a week—that’s untargeted for you.

💬 Nicola Willis: Does he, on reflection, agree with the advice by Treasury that inflation is unlikely to dissipate in the short term, which makes a one-off payment a poor mechanism for supporting households with a longer-term problem?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: What the Treasury went on to advise was that if a payment was temporary or targeted, it had less likelihood of exacerbating inflation. What we decided was, alongside the investments that are long term—such as lifting main income benefits, such as our ongoing commitment to the winter energy payment—that some temporary and targeted support for a wider group of New Zealanders was justified. That member and her leader spent several weeks telling the Government that they needed to look after the squeezed middle. We did it.

💬 Nicola Willis: Can he confirm that because of the compressed time lines for the design of this payment, no data from Immigration New Zealand was used by Inland Revenue in making the payment, so there could be tens or hundreds of thousands of New Zealanders living overseas who have received this payment?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: I cannot confirm the claim that the member has made. What I can confirm is that the Government responded to the fact that we needed to move quickly. The Opposition were telling us it was a crisis. We took action to make sure that money is getting into the pockets of New Zealanders earning less than $70,000 a year. The member used to think that that was important.

💬 Nicola Willis: Is the Minister surprised to learn of a written question answer from David Parker, the Minister of Revenue, in which he said, “I have been informed Inland Revenue has not worked with Immigration New Zealand in implementing the cost of living payment.”, and don’t you think it would have been a good idea for them to do that?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: As the member knows, because she put the written question to the Minister of Revenue, those are matters operationally for the ministry of Inland Revenue. What I do know is that the payment has reached nearly 1.4 million New Zealanders, who are being supported through a cost of living crisis. The member might not like the fact that the policy has been delivered, but it has been delivered. It is targeted, and it is reaching the people who need it.

💬 Nicola Willis: Why does the Minister insist on calling the payment targeted when he knows it’s being sprayed around the world, it’s gone to high-income households and deceased people, he was warned by Inland Revenue that their data wasn’t up to date, and he didn’t have any time to address that because he was acting in a reactive panic?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: I’ll tell you what’s untargeted. What’s untargeted is a policy that would give thousands of dollars to the highest-income earners while giving $2 a week to people who are on the minimum wage. The Government, as we have done throughout COVID, has taken action quickly to support New Zealanders.

Question No. 3—Arts, Culture and Heritage

3. to the Minister for Arts, Culture and Heritage: What announcements has she made about supporting jobs in the arts sector?

Last week, I had the pleasure of announcing the extension of the successful Aotearoa Touring Programme at the Pacific Music Awards 2022. The programme has been extended until June 2023 and sees an additional investment of $1.5 million. Extending the programme assists the ongoing recovery of domestic music touring and supports the thriving hospitality sector. The programme has a focus on tours that reach beyond the main cities into the regions so that all New Zealanders can experience the magic of live performance. The impacts of COVID-19 were felt particularly hard in Aotearoa’s live music scene and, with the Government’s backing, our home-grown musicians can continue their road to recovery.

Anahila Kanongata‘a-Suisuiki: Why is this announcement important?

💬 Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: This announcement is important because it will continue to help save jobs and protect the livelihoods of artists and musicians who make a living from putting on performances and shows. The Aotearoa Touring Programme, to date, has supported more than 1,700 shows and over 250 artists. It’s also estimated that around 200,000 New Zealanders have been able to attend shows as a result of the programme. We know the Aotearoa Touring Programme has been successful, supporting artists and household names like TEEKS, Drax Project, Nadia Reid, Stan Walker, Reb Fountain, and Shapeshifter. [Multiple members interject] Not everyone in the House will know all of those people! That’s why extending it is important, so more Kiwis can enjoy the best of home-grown talent and live music.

Anahila Kanongata‘a-Suisuiki: What feedback has she seen on the Aotearoa Touring Programme?

💬 Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: Singer and songwriter Reb Fountain said, “Funding touring with the Aotearoa Touring Programme is the most viable way of supporting musicians to do their work, to employ crew and venues, and bring entertainment to folks across Aotearoa.” She goes on to say, “It’s great to see the Government prioritising our community and ensuring we can provide exceptional music events for all. Long may that continue.” When the heat is on, the beat goes on!

💬 Hon Grant Robertson: Would the Minister be surprised to learn that funding such as this has been described in this House by MPs as “crap”, and what would her response be to that?

💬 Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: My response would be—

💬 DEPUTY SPEAKER: Let me have a think about that.

💬 Hon Grant Robertson: It was a direct quote.

💬 DEPUTY SPEAKER: Yeah, so far as the Minister has responsibility she can answer.

💬 Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: My response to that would be that that really is an indication of how out of touch some of the ACT and National Party members really are.

Question No. 4—Housing

4. to the Minister of Housing: Has she been advised that “Current financial modelling (without efficiency savings) shows Kāinga Ora is unable to repay the full $28.9 billion of forecast debt within the next 60 years”, and what steps, if any, has she taken to assure herself that Kāinga Ora is complying with section 51 of the Crown Entities Act 2004 in relation to its long-term financial viability?

on behalf of the Minister of Housing: In answer to the first part of the question, yes. However, I note that the paper this quote is drawing from is based on assumptions about current policy settings and market conditions over a 60-year time frame. A lot can change over 60 years, and I note that at least some of the financial challenges Kāinga Ora faces are driven by the lack of investment by the previous Government in properly building and maintaining our public housing stock. On behalf of the Minister, in answer to the second part, I have received advice on Kāinga Ora’s long-term financial sustainability and sought further advice from both the Ministry of Housing and Urban Development and Kāinga Ora on the issues raised. It is prudent to review funding settings, particularly when market conditions such as increasing build costs are changing. The Government will confirm any changes in funding settings if they are agreed, typically as part of the Budget process.

💬 Chris Bishop: Did she call in the board of Kāinga Ora, following the 17 June 2022 briefing from the Ministry of Housing and Urban Development that warned that the four-year view of Kāinga Ora is “concerning”, and what actions, if any, did Kāinga Ora undertake to do as a result?

As I referred to in my opening comments and answer to the primary question, the indication is that things can change and that Kāinga Ora has said that the policy setting and market conditions over a 60-year time frame can change. So that remains the advice.

💬 Chris Bishop: Point of order, Mr Speaker. It was a very specific question: did she call in the board of Kāinga Ora, following the 17 June 2022 briefing, and what actions did Kāinga Ora take?

💬 DEPUTY SPEAKER: Take it as asked again, and the Minister can respond to it.

As I said, the second part of the question was what I referred to in my answer—that the advice is that we note the paper this quote is drawn from is based on assumptions about current policy settings and market conditions, and a lot can change over 60 years.

💬 DEPUTY SPEAKER: I’ll give the member another question because I think the main part was the first part. If you want to ask that.

💬 Chris Bishop: Did she call in the board of Kāinga Ora, following the 17 June 2022 briefing from the Ministry of Housing and Urban Development?

On behalf of the Minister, the Minister meets regularly with the Kāinga Ora board. I don’t have the dates for when the meetings may have occurred.

💬 Chris Bishop: Has the Government sought advice on whether Kāinga Ora is compliant with the Crown Entities Act, particularly that it “prudently manages its assets and liabilities and endeavours to ensure it acts as a successful going concern”, and, if so, from whom was that advice sought?

Kāinga Ora is compliant.

💬 Chris Bishop: Is she confident that Kāinga Ora will meet its current delivery commitments?

On behalf of the Minister, yes.

💬 Chris Bishop: Is she concerned that, on its current track, Kāinga Ora will not be able to cover its depreciation costs and will have to issue debt on the same asset again to pay for its replacement or renewal, and how is this consistent with the obligation for Kāinga Ora to be financially sustainable?

On behalf of the Minister, what I’m concerned about is the fact that the public housing stock was so run down by the previous Government, and the existing stock was not cared for, and that is why there are some concerns that are raised in the report that the member speaks about with regards to finances moving forward.

💬 DEPUTY SPEAKER: No, that wasn’t addressed at all. The first part of the question, again, I think, is the main part—so if you want to ask that again.

💬 Chris Bishop: Is she concerned that, on its current track, Kāinga Ora will not be able to cover its depreciation costs and will have to issue debt on the same asset again to pay for its replacement or renewal?

At this stage, on behalf of the Minister, we have no concerns.

💬 Chris Bishop: What is her definition of “financially sustainable”?

Ensuring that we have the money available to us to be able to continue to invest in future public housing and ensure that we’re able to provide the houses that are needed for the general population, unlike what was left to us when we took over Government, when our housing stock had been run down.

💬 Chris Bishop: Is she concerned that, on current projections, by 2025 Kāinga Ora will reporting negative net operating cash-flows, so that Kāinga Ora will be issuing more debt to pay the interest costs on its existing debt?

As said earlier, the assumptions are questionable.

Question No. 5—Women

Tēnā koe, Mr Speaker. [Removes mask] Bit of a fashion—

💬 DEPUTY SPEAKER: What was that?

💬 ANGIE WARREN-CLARK: Sorry [Holds up mask] I—

💬 DEPUTY SPEAKER: You—just read the question.

5. to the Minister for Women: What progress has been made to ensure greater diversity and representation of women on public boards?

Last week, I released the results of the annual stocktake of public sector boards and committees, untaken annually by Manatū Wāhine Ministry for Women. I’m pleased to inform the House that, as of December 2021, women now hold 52.5 percent of positions on Cabinet-appointed public sector boards and committees. This is the greatest ever percentage. Over 2021, 54.6 percent of new appointments were women, and this is the second consecutive year we have met Cabinet’s 2018 target of 50 percent for women’s representation. There is no shortage of various skilled women for governance roles, and I am glad many are able to strengthen the governance on public sector boards.

💬 Angie Warren-Clark: What improvements have been made to the collection of ethnicity data on public boards?

💬 Hon JAN TINETTI: We have received ethnicity data for 98.9 percent of board members. The results show gradual improvement in the ethnic diversity of our board members. Compared with 2020, we have seen increases in the representation of Māori, Pacific, Asian and Middle Eastern, Latin American, and African board members. We are committed to increasing ethnic diversity across public sector boards, and Manatū Wāhine have been working collaboratively with the Ministry for Pacific Peoples, the Ministry for Ethnic Communities, and the new Whaikaha - Ministry of Disabled People, and Te Puni Kōkiri to support the development of a pipeline of diverse board-ready candidates. The cross-agency group recently hosted an online webinar focused on preparing a good governance CV, which was very well attended. More sessions are planned over the coming months.

💬 Angie Warren-Clark: Why is having diverse representation on boards important?

💬 Hon JAN TINETTI: It is important that public boards have the relevant skills and expertise and reflect the vibrant diversity of our country. The facts prove that diverse boards bring a wider range of knowledge, expertise, and skill, which, of course, can only be of benefit to the organisation the board is governing. By making our organisations, and boards that govern them, more inviting environments for under-represented groups, we will attract and retain the best talent and we’ll better understand the needs of clients and the wider public. I would like to thank my Cabinet colleagues for nominating and appointing such a talented and diverse group of candidates. I look forward to further diversity across all governance boards in the future.

Question No. 6—Health

6. to the Minister of Health: Does he consider recent health campaigns have been successful; if so, how many people were employed under the Kiwi Health Jobs critical care nursing campaign to 30 June 2022?

In response to the first part of the question, yes. Recent health campaigns include the 2021 COVID-19 vaccination campaign, the single biggest health campaign in the country’s history. That campaign saw more than 11 million doses of the vaccine administered by a workforce of literally thousands of people, many of whom were assembled especially for that campaign. Turning to the second part of the question, the Kiwi Health Jobs critical care nursing campaign was one of several recruitment campaigns to recruit nurses from within and outside New Zealand. Between February and the end of June this year, the campaign resulted in 175 applications for critical nurse positions—80 were withdrawn or declined; 46 candidates were referred to Te Whatu Ora - Health New Zealand; 25 candidates have indicated that they would be available more than 12 months from now; another 13 are at the interview stage; and yet another 14 are still being processed by Kiwi Health Jobs; 10 candidates are not critical care nurses, but are being considered for other roles. It’s not possible to say how many people were employed as a result of the campaign, because the employment process for 62 applicants has not yet concluded. Ultimately, New Zealand needs more nurses, and this campaign is only one of a wider and ongoing workforce plan to train more nurses in New Zealand, get nurses not currently practising back into the workforce, and to attract nurses from overseas.

💬 Dr Shane Reti: Does he stand by his reply to written questions in April that a total of three people were employed under his critical care nurses Kiwi Health Jobs campaign?

💬 Hon ANDREW LITTLE: The member may not have observed, but it is currently August, and in the months and weeks since April, work continues, including on nurse recruitment campaigns, which is why many more people have been processed as a result of that campaign than was the case in April.

💬 Dr Shane Reti: How can he consider the measles catch-up campaign a success, when he wrote to me that in the high measles risk area of Tai Rāwhiti, only 28 people in the target group were vaccinated over the two years of the campaign?

💬 Hon ANDREW LITTLE: The member highlights the very need for Te Aka Whai Ora, the Māori Health Authority, which that member and his party has opposed throughout. The reality is the equity performance of our health system when it comes to even childhood immunisations has been woeful, and we need Māori leadership where it counts in the health system, and now we will have it with Te Aka Whai Ora, the Māori Health Authority.

💬 Dr Shane Reti: Is it correct that despite all the immunisation campaigns that he wrote to me about, that child immunisation rates were falling before COVID, and overall have fallen dramatically under this Government?

💬 Hon ANDREW LITTLE: The member, again, highlights the point that even before COVID-19, there were real problems with our immunisation campaigns, particularly for Māori and Pacific children. That’s why this Government has made the commitment to improve the equity performance of our health system, including by having Te Aka Whai Ora, the Māori Health Authority, which that member and his party has vociferously opposed.

💬 Dr Shane Reti: Did the measles catch-up campaign fail Māori in his hands, when of the tens of thousands of Māori in the target group, only 4,000 were vaccinated over the two years of a $20 million campaign?

💬 Hon ANDREW LITTLE: It would be a failure if this country doesn’t recognise that we have to do better when it comes to equity performance in our health system. That’s why this Government has fronted up and we’ve established Te Aka Whai Ora, the Māori Health Authority, something that that member and his party deeply opposes.

💬 Dr Shane Reti: Does he stand by his claim in the House last week that the New Zealand Nurses Organisation came up with the idea of engaging with Shortland Street, when they have published that “It was actually the Ministry of Health team and not the New Zealand Nurses Organisation who suggested Shortland Street could be used as an aspect of the campaign.”, and that “There is no way it could accurately reflect what is happening for nurses.”?

💬 Hon ANDREW LITTLE: The Real Nurses campaign was a collaboration between the Ministry of Health and the New Zealand Nurses Organisation, entered into at the request of the New Zealand Nurses Organisation. A steering group was established that had Nurses Organisation representation on it, and part of the work of that steering group was, in addition to developing a website, reaching out through other channels to publicise the nature of nurses’ work, and it included, as a result of advice from the creative agency that was assisting them, establishing a relationship with Shortland Street. Everything that was done in that regard was fully known and understood by the New Zealand Nurses Organisation.

Question No. 7—Finance

7. to the Minister of Finance: What reports, if any, has he seen on the impacts of monetary and fiscal policy throughout the COVID-19 pandemic on the distribution of wealth in this country?

I’ve seen a range of reports on the impact of economic policy measures on wealth inequality, some of these from the time, and some with the benefit of hindsight. Throughout the crisis, we took the approach to prioritise those who were the most vulnerable and tend to disproportionately bear the cost of an economic shock. That’s why we lifted main income benefits three times, we lifted the minimum wage, and we doubled the winter energy payment. The wage subsidy scheme was designed not just to provide cash flow and confidence to businesses but to keep New Zealanders in their jobs. I appreciate that the member may disagree with some of the decisions that were taken and some of the outcomes that have occurred since then. A decision that we would do less in response to a one-in-100-year shock would have meant accepting a greater risk that lower-income people would have suffered through the pandemic. I would never claim that our economic response was perfect—or our health response, for that matter—but I am proud of the way in which we have supported households and businesses through a period of intense uncertainty. I’m proud of the way that New Zealanders have continued to manage the ongoing supply side impacts of the pandemic, and I’m proud that, for example, the Māori unemployment rate, which reached almost 15 percent after the global financial crisis, is now at 5.5 percent.

Chlöe Swarbrick: Did he accept the conclusions of Treasury advice received in 2020 that large-scale asset purchase measures could “raise asset prices more directly than conventional monetary policy, creating wealth inequality”; if so, what actions did he take to minimise the risk once unconventional monetary policy was used by the Reserve Bank?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: As you would expect, in the advice that was provided, the pros and the cons of any issue or any particular policy approach are listed off. I think it’s important to remember the problem that the monetary policy response was trying to address. We had bond markets that were beginning to look like they would be in free-fall. We had the potential of a significant credit crunch. There was a role for monetary policy, and, unfortunately, conventional monetary policy tools were not in a position to be able to be used.

Chlöe Swarbrick: Does he think ordinary New Zealanders are justified in feeling angry that over the course of the COVID-19 pandemic the wealthiest New Zealanders grew $872 billion richer, according to 2021 analysis by economist Bernard Hickey?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: I’ve, obviously, read Mr Hickey’s analysis, and I have a great deal of respect for him. However, I don’t think that quite captures where that support went, because the wage subsidy scheme was designed specifically to ensure that people stayed in work. While it was paid to businesses, it played a very important part in making sure that New Zealanders kept their jobs.

Chlöe Swarbrick: Does he consider it fair that ordinary New Zealanders are currently watching their purchasing power go backwards while foreign-owned banks, as supported by the Reserve Bank, rake in excessive profits; if not, what fiscal options is he considering to redress the balance and provide support to vulnerable people?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: I think I have an expectation, as I think most New Zealanders would, that we don’t see parts of the economy, or actors within the economy, use their market power to take advantage of consumers, and we’ve already been addressing those sorts of issues—for example, in the supermarket sector. What I would also say, however, is that the stability of the banking system has served New Zealanders particularly well during times of crisis such as COVID-19. But I do understand the spirit of the question that the member is asking.

Chlöe Swarbrick: Does he stand by his statement, “we’re saying ‘we have your backs’ through the measures we have in place, including the wage subsidy and working capital support alongside the banks.”, and, in the context of the COVID-19 support; if he does, does the Government now have the backs of those worst-off or those who made unearned and excessive profits?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: In respect of the first part of the question, yes.

Question No. 8—Transport

8. to the Minister of Transport: What recent reports has he seen on the progress of the Clean Car Discount scheme?

I’ve seen some excellent recent reports which show that the Clean Car Discount scheme is progressing very well, with over 19,500 rebates already processed. In just its first year, the scheme has proven a huge success with more than 57,000 light electric and non – plug-in hybrid vehicles registered, and, in some recent months, around about 45 percent of imports into New Zealand being low- or zero-emissions vehicles. Importers are responding to the surge in demand, and we’re seeing a greater number and a greater range of low-emissions vehicles across all types for Kiwis. By choosing to purchase electric vehicles, New Zealanders are collectively helping our nation to transition to a cleaner, more efficient vehicle fleet. Our world is experiencing a climate crisis, and while some oppose any change to reduce emissions, our Government is acting.

💬 Shanan Halbert: What benefits is the Clean Car Discount scheme providing for our country’s greenhouse gas emissions?

💬 Hon MICHAEL WOOD: New Zealand sits at the end of a very long supply chain and could easily become a dumping ground for the world’s dirtiest vehicles. We know that transport emissions make up 43 percent of New Zealand’s total carbon dioxide emissions, and the Clean Car Discount is helping to power the transition of our vehicle fleet along. Over the long run, cleaner electric vehicles also will prove to be cheaper for consumers to maintain once fuel costs are taken into account. By reducing the upfront cost through rebates to New Zealanders, we’re making clean vehicles a more viable option and enabling a domestic second-hand market for clean vehicles to flourish for all New Zealanders to access.

💬 Shanan Halbert: What other work is the Government doing to build on the success of the Clean Car Discount scheme to decarbonise the transport sector?

💬 Hon MICHAEL WOOD: We’ve seen the impact of climate change over the last month, with extreme weather events in New Zealand and a record heat wave in Europe, so it is time to act. The reality of climate change is upon us. In the transport sector, as well as the Clean Car Discount scheme, the Government is building mass rapid transit solutions in our major cities, supporting higher-quality public transport, and investing in high-quality walking and cycling projects all around the country, and all of these measures will help to reduce our carbon emissions. On this side of the House, we’ve set out a pathway to reaching our emission targets by 2050. The Clean Car Discount scheme is proving to be enormously successful—above expectations—in helping us to get there.

💬 Simeon Brown: Has the Minister seen reports that the Clean Car Discount scheme has paid out more than $85 million more in discounts and subsidies than has been received in fees, and, if so, is the Minister considering increasing the car tax on hard-working Kiwis to continue subsidising wealthy Kiwis who can already afford Teslas?

💬 Hon MICHAEL WOOD: I’ve seen a range of reports about the level of discounts and fees charged under the scheme, and, as anyone who had been following the policy in any detail would be aware, the fees under the scheme only came into effect on 1 April this year; whereas the rebate started on 1 July last year. That is why there is an imbalance at this stage. There is a much-closer balance between the two over recent months. In respect of the member’s suggestion that the scheme is only delivering for high-income New Zealanders, he is absolutely wrong. The largest-selling vehicle types under the Clean Car Discount scheme are on the used side for vehicles that are commonly sold at under $20,000.

Question No. 9—Health

9. to the Minister of Health: How many nurses are currently needed to eliminate shortages within the health system, and has this number increased since he stated in April, “We are about 3,000 nurses short in our public health system. In the private sector, aged retirement, it’s roughly 1,000 nurses”?

As of 31 March this year, there are recorded 3,335 vacant nursing fulltime-equivalent positions in our public health system. The number of nurses working in our public health system has increased by about 2,000 since this Government was elected. In regard to the private aged-care sector, there are a number of private data sets that suggest the number of vacancies is roughly the figure that the member has referred to, although the latest figure I’ve seen suggests it’s about 900—but 900-1,000. As I’ve already said today, there are a number of measures being taken to address health workforce shortages.

Brooke van Velden: Why, then, in reply to my written question No. 24316 does he state that we need 4,700 nurses to eliminate the shortage, and is this a case of the Minister being unaware of the needs of our nurses and the health system?

💬 Hon ANDREW LITTLE: No, it’s the fact that there are a range of data sets around, some of which combine both public and private health nurse vacancies; some of which separate them out. I suspect that figure was a combination of both public and private nurse vacancies.

Brooke van Velden: Is the Minister aware that between January and March 2021, Australia had over 418 more nurses caring for every 100,000 of their citizens than New Zealand did, and, if the Minister is aware of this, why did his Government not put nurses on the Green List straight-to-residence pathway?

💬 Hon ANDREW LITTLE: I’m not quite sure what the relevance of figures more than 18 months ago are to the current situation. There is a worldwide shortage of nurses. The United Kingdom has a shortage of registered nurses of roughly 50,000. Australia has a massive shortage of registered nurses. We have a shortage of registered nurses. We have changed our immigration policies and established the Green List, which now makes it easier than ever before for health workers, in particular, to cross our border and take up jobs here. They are queuing up and they are taking jobs here.

Brooke van Velden: Does the Minister agree that his Government has neglected the healthcare sector when the number of nurses working per 100,000 New Zealanders has only increased by 5.57 percent since March 2028; yet during that same time period, the number of nurses working for every 100,000 Australians increased by over 13 percent?

💬 Hon ANDREW LITTLE: No, and I’m not quite sure why the member referred to the month of March 2028.

Question No. 10—Diversity, Inclusion and Ethnic Communities

10. to the Minister for Diversity, Inclusion and Ethnic Communities: What recent announcements has she made about this Government’s ongoing support of ethnic communities in Aotearoa?

Today, the Ministry for Ethnic Communities released its inaugural strategy that sets out tangible actions that it will take over the next few years to work to create a more cohesive society where everyone feels safe, valued, a sense of belonging, and able to contribute to Aotearoa’s growth. The ministry’s strategy is informed by the communities it serves. It lays out work that the ministry will lead and work that the ministry will undertake in collaboration with other Government agencies to achieve the outcomes sought by our communities. Our ethnic communities make a significant contribution to New Zealand. However, it’s also true that many groups face specific barriers that lead to poorer social and economic outcomes. For example, many have told us that they struggle to access Government services that are relevant to them, and find work that pays them fairly, and that’s why this strategy includes a strong focus on strengthening initiatives to improve economic outcomes, including addressing barriers to employment and supporting workplaces to be more inclusive.

💬 Vanushi Walters: How will the strategy support an inclusive labour market that enables ethnic communities to pursue jobs?

💬 Hon PRIYANCA RADHAKRISHNAN: Many from our ethnic communities work in some of the hardest-hit sectors and so have been disproportionately impacted by the pandemic, but this Government has worked hard to deliver record low unemployment at 3.3 percent, against expectations when COVID hit that it could rise as high as 10 percent. It is vital, though, that we continue to support our communities in ways that are relevant to them. This strategy will work in alignment with the Government’s Former Refugees, Recent Migrants, and Ethnic Communities Employment Action Plan, and focuses on addressing some really specific barriers to finding meaningful work, skills development, and also supporting the workplaces to become more diverse and more inclusive. Another key action that’s already under way is the Ethnic Communities Graduate Programme, that both provides a first employment option into the Public Service and makes the Public Service more culturally competent.

💬 DEPUTY SPEAKER: That answer was far too long. You’d actually addressed the question. I didn’t interrupt you, but I’m going to offer the Opposition an additional question if they would like to ask this Minister.

💬 Vanushi Walters: How does the strategy build on the Government’s support for ethnic communities to grow their skills, celebrate their culture, and take part in society?

💬 Hon PRIYANCA RADHAKRISHNAN: This Government has continued to support ethnic communities to thrive through the Ethnic Communities Development Fund, that was actually increased eightfold in the last term of Government. Since July 2021, we’ve supported about 345 programmes across the country that do exactly this, and I’m confident that this strategy will help us to continue along that trajectory.

💬 Melissa Lee: How many successful nominations to increase ethnic diversity on public sector boards has the Ministry for Ethnic Communities made, and is the answer still one successful nomination since its establishment, per the Minister’s reply to written parliamentary question No. 11188 on 11 April this year?

💬 Hon PRIYANCA RADHAKRISHNAN: Once again, that was back in April—it’s clearly been a fair few long months for the National Party. There is a significant work programme by the Ministry for Ethnic Communities to ensure that we support nominations made by various other Ministers into diverse boards, and you’ll know from the previous answer by Minister Tinetti that we’ve actually seen an increase in the number of people from ethnic communities on public sector boards.

💬 Melissa Lee: Point of order. Thank you, Mr Speaker. The question was very specific, and it actually said, “How many successful nominations to increase ethnic diversity on public sector boards”, and the Minister did not answer that question.

💬 DEPUTY SPEAKER: Yeah, but she did actually address it within her answer.

💬 Hon Michael Wood: Supplementary.

💬 DEPUTY SPEAKER: Supplementary—the Hon Michael Wood [Interruption] Order! We have a question.

💬 Hon Michael Wood: Does the Minister believe that all organisations should consider the diversity of representation that they present to the community?

💬 DEPUTY SPEAKER: The Minister can answer, but be very careful that that question is not targeted at another political party.

💬 Chris Bishop: Point of order, Mr Speaker. That supplementary just does not flow from the primary question, which is about announcements about the Government’s ongoing support of ethnic communities, notwithstanding the Minister’s extremely long and fluffy answer.

💬 DEPUTY SPEAKER: The Minister can respond in so far as it relates to the primary question and her responsibilities—don’t go outside that.

💬 Hon PRIYANCA RADHAKRISHNAN: Yes, absolutely. We’ve heard time and again from ethnic communities that while they want to be supported into employment, and into leadership positions in various spaces, we also need to make sure that those spaces are representative of them.

Question No. 11—Education (School Operations)

11. to the Associate Minister of Education (School Operations): Does she stand by her statements and actions?

Yes.

💬 Erica Stanford: Can she guarantee that New Zealand will be included in the Programme for International Student Assessment, given that our critically low school response rate of 63 percent is classified as not acceptable?

💬 Hon JAN TINETTI: Mr Speaker, I didn’t quite hear the start of that question. The mike wasn’t on. Could we hear that again, please?

💬 DEPUTY SPEAKER: Sorry. We’ve got some movement in the gallery. I’ll just ask the member to—

💬 Erica Stanford: Can she guarantee that New Zealand will be included in the Programme for International Student Assessment (PISA), given that our critically low school response rate of 63 percent is classified as not acceptable?

💬 Hon JAN TINETTI: Yes.

💬 Erica Stanford: How can she guarantee that our inclusion in the latest Programme for International Student Assessment study will happen, when ministry advice around our critically low uptake at 63 percent says that we will not know definitively if our data can be considered until early 2023, because we haven’t met the minimum requirement to participate?

💬 Hon JAN TINETTI: The ministry is continuing to work on that and the member is a little bit behind in her details in what she has. They have worked on that with some haste.

💬 Erica Stanford: What percentage of schools are currently participating in the PISA testing studies?

💬 Hon JAN TINETTI: I don’t actually have that number in front of me at this point in time, but if the member would like to put that in writing, I’m certain that we can get that to her.

💬 Hon Grant Robertson: Point of order. The primary question was the traditional Opposition question of “Does the Minister stand by her statements and actions?” To have a cacophony of noise when a very specific point is—

💬 Nicola Willis: Oh, diddums.

💬 Hon Grant Robertson: —or even to interrupt during a point of order, is out of order.

💬 DEPUTY SPEAKER: I’ll deal with one at a time.

💬 Hon Grant Robertson: So I think, to have that response—we know that if members want specific details, they should put down specific questions. To have that response come back at the Minister is simply out of order.

💬 Chris Bishop: Speaking to the point of order, that is a legitimate point, except that the Minister in her response to, I think, the second supplementary question, essentially, implied that the questioner was behind the times and that the Minister had access to information that the questioner did not have access to, and thereby implied to the House that she had all the information at her fingertips. So my colleague Erica Stanford asked a very legitimate question, which was just a simple: what is the percentage of schools that are participating? So it flowed directly from the supplementary question that came before.

💬 DEPUTY SPEAKER: I think the supplementary was in order. I think it was very difficult for probably anyone to hear the answer. I have no idea whether it’s been addressed or not because of the volume coming from my left. I’m assuming the Minister has addressed it and that’s where it will lie, except that the member Nicola Willis will stand, withdraw, and apologise for her interruption of a point of order.

💬 Nicola Willis: I withdraw and apologise.

💬 DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you.

💬 Erica Stanford: Does she think that it’s acceptable that the Government Statistician has had to intervene and act on a duty of care to protect PISA’s integrity, by sending a letter to school boards and principals to encourage them to participate, when it is her responsibility as the Associate Minister of Education?

💬 Hon JAN TINETTI: This year has been the most difficult that schools have faced. COVID-19 in 2022 has brought the biggest challenges to the schooling sector that they have ever faced. In fact, I was just at a school this morning where the principal was telling us of the absolute difficulties that they have seen. It is absolutely warranted that the Chief Statistician would send that letter out to schools. I have also asked schools, myself, through many different avenues, to become involved in this. We are using every avenue that we can, and I can confirm to the member that this is of importance to us.

💬 Erica Stanford: Why did she not act with more urgency to guarantee our participation beyond doubt, when she was advised by her officials that for this cycle especially, PISA will contain significant insights into how our learners are doing academically and personally after two years of disruption from the COVID-19 pandemic?

💬 Hon JAN TINETTI: I refute the premise of that question. I have acted with great urgency around this through many different avenues, as I’ve said in the last supplementary question.

Question No. 12—Education (Pacific Peoples)

12. to the Associate Minister of Education (Pacific Peoples): Fa‘afetai lava lau afioga le fofoga fetalai. What has the Government done for Pacific peoples since the delivery of the formal Dawn Raids apology a year ago?

Today, the Government announced 35 recipients of the Tulī Takes Flight Scholarships, which were a key part of last year’s Dawn Raids apology. The scholarships are a part of this Government’s gesture of a reconciliation to mark the apology by this Government for the harms during the Dawn Raids of the 1970s. The Government tasked the Ministry of Education to establish the Tulī Takes Flight Scholarships for Aotearoa-Pacific peoples as one part of the gesture of goodwill reconciliation package. The Tulī bird migrates from the Pacific on a 20,000 kilometre round trip every year to their breeding grounds in Alaska, north-west Canada, and Siberia. It is a powerful symbol of our Pacific peoples of Aotearoa and their migration story, their stamina, their resilience, their courage, and their determination to learn, succeed, and thrive in Aotearoa New Zealand.

💬 Dr Anae Neru Leavasa: How are these scholarships going to support Pacific learners and Pacific families?

💬 Hon AUPITO WILLIAM SIO: The Tūli scholarships will support Pacific learners and families to reach their potential by reducing some of the financial barriers to study or training. In our part of the goodwill gestures of reconciliation to accompany the New Zealand Government’s apology to Pacific families and communities impacted by the racist experiences of the Dawn Raids in the 1970s, each of the recipients will receive between $10,000 and $30,000, depending on their course of study. Budget 2022 also allocated more funding to support additional scholarships in the next four years. The successful Tūli scholarship recipients were chosen from right across the motu of Aotearoa. They and their families will be present at the first year’s commemoration of the Dawn Raids apology at the Ngāti Whātua Ōrākei Marae on 27 August.

💬 Dr Anae Neru Leavasa: What is going to happen at the first commemoration of the Dawn Raids apology on 27 August?

💬 Hon AUPITO WILLIAM SIO: This will herald a pivotal partnership between the iwi of Ngāti Whātua Ōrākei and Pacific peoples of Aotearoa. It signals the Government’s commitment to deliver on education and a comprehensive historic record of the Dawn Raids so that we can collectively tackle the issues of racism and discrimination the Government apologised for during the Dawn Raids periods and of which our young Māori and Pacific people continue to experience and talk about even today. Māori and Pacific acknowledge together the need to fight against systemic racism and discrimination, and will forge a new partnership, utilising education and these Tūli scholarships as one of the number of tools to combat racism and discrimination in Aotearoa. The lessons from the Dawn Raid experiences: good Governments must eliminate racism and discrimination at all levels for the sake of our young people realising their fullest potential.

💬 Teanau Tuiono: Does he agree with Princess Mele Siu‘ilikutapu Kalaniuvalu Fotofili, who said, “The Government should address the immigration needs of the Pacific community as part of the apology.”, and, if so, will he advocate for an amnesty for overstayers?

💬 Hon AUPITO WILLIAM SIO: As a population Minister, I constantly advocate for all the things that our Pacific communities ask for. It is well-known, my view, with the Minister of Immigration. That consideration is part of the immigration reset work that’s currently happening.