Oversight of Oranga Tamariki System and Children and Young People’s Commission Bill

Kia ora e te Māngai o te Whare. I rise to take a quick call on this. I want, first, to acknowledge that social workers have a very difficult job, and Oranga Tamariki social workers all the more difficult. They work with people and whānau in extremis. They work with them when they are angry, they are hurt, and they are not functioning. It is difficult work, but it is work where if you make a mistake or a misjudgment, the consequences are extreme, and, unfortunately, we have seen, again and again, that Oranga Tamariki have not been getting it right. This Government is determined to assist to make that system whole, and to create one that is fit for Aotearoa New Zealand into the 21st century.

In so doing, we need to address the fundamental question: quis custodiet ipsos custodes—who guards the guardians, of our children, in this case. As someone who has spent time with Oranga Tamariki, making complaints, taking complaints through that process, I can tell you it is, at present, incredibly fraught, incredibly difficult, to get sense out of Oranga Tamariki, because at present, it often feels like no one guards the guardians but themselves, and the people they are guarding are themselves and not our tamariki.

So I am delighted to see that we are now bringing in a system where there will be independent monitoring and evaluation from within the system, where there is no power of the Minister to stop the investigator going where they will, and bringing the information back; an independent complaints process strengthened by the greater role of the Ombudsman; and, finally, a strengthened role for the Office of the Children’s Commissioner, where there will not be just one person but a number to investigate the important roles that affect our children across society. Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? Well, now there’s going to be someone. I commend this bill to the House.

The next call is a split call. I call Joseph Mooney.

I arise on behalf of the National Party to speak on the Oversight of Oranga Tamariki and Children and Young People’s Commission Bill. National supports this bill to select committee. National is sensitive to the unfortunate reality that the stresses and pressures that have led to an uptick in family harm, violence, and abuse, and children are sadly more susceptible to ill treatment. National believes that no effort should be spared in protecting the welfare of children. But the focus needs to be very squarely on protecting children, and not expanding the powers of Government.

There are some key points that need to be worked through at select committee in terms of the independence of the Children’s Commissioner and in what guise that will continue, or not. It’s important that there is an independent body that is completely focused on the welfare of children and not one that is beholden to the politics of the day.

There are some good things in this bill, having a look through it. There are some cultural competencies that are being referred to. And I note that it’s referring also to article 3 of the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child, and one of those is “Taking due account of the importance of the traditions and cultural values of each people for the protection and harmonious development of the child”, and I note some effort has been made, particularly in respect of Māori, with clause 92 stating that “At least half of the board members must have Māori knowledge; and have experience in, and knowledge of, tikanga Māori.” And the duties of the board, in clause 96 are to: “build and maintain relationships with iwi, Māori organisations, organisations representing children’s and young people’s issues, youth-led organisations, community organisations, departments, and other agencies by having a strong focus on the rights, interests, and well-being of Māori children and young people within the context of their whānau, hapū, and iwi” and also “promoting Māori participation and leadership, and te ao Māori approaches, in the performance of its functions, as appropriate.”

This bill does represent some progress towards a fully independent watchdog for Oranga Tamariki. Independent oversight is really crucial and it contributes to building transparency. Importantly, it contributes to building public trust and confidence in the system, which is necessary as Oranga Tamariki has certainly gone through something of a crisis of confidence in recent times. There is a need for public confidence to be rebuilt and certainly independent oversight would be valuable in helping build that confidence.

Where Government has strong statutory powers, such as the power to apply to the Family Court to remove children and young people from their families and to place them with caregivers or in care and protection residences, independent oversight is particularly important for people to feel that the appropriate processes are being followed, that there isn’t Government overreach—particularly reaching into families inappropriately. Certainly, I think all of us have at least been aware of, if not seen, some of the footage, which was quite concerning, previously on some uplifts regarding some families. Having an additional safeguard in terms of independent oversight to help ensure the wellbeing and safety of both the children and their whānau, families would certainly be a good thing.

The Ministry rightly recognises that many public facing organisations have independent monitoring organisations—the Education Review Office, the Health and Disability Commissioner, the Independent Police Conduct Authority and the Ombudsman. There’s certainly a lot of potential for things to go wrong in the fraught area of child protection, which involves a lot of very complex issues in many cases. And just like the police, there really does need to be some independent oversight and that would be a good thing.

Therefore, National does support this bill to select committee. We will seek to contribute constructive feedback and seek to help improve the bill to make sure it is one that can last the test of time and contribute to that public confidence and the important exercise of the Oranga Tamariki, which is, fundamentally, to ensure the wellbeing and safety of children in our country. Thank you, Madam Speaker.

Kia ora, Madam Speaker, and it’s great to know that there’s some consensus around the House that this is a bill that needs to go to select committee and that we are all placing the interests of our most vulnerable children first and foremost.

I echo the words of my colleague Dr Emily Henderson when she noted that this is some of the most difficult work that our professionals with children can do, and that in some cases these are non-functioning families and there’s no perfect option, just least worst options. But, having said that it’s really important that there is a good system of accountability, and when things don’t work out as they should, that they can be examined and we can learn from them. So a good monitoring function to make sure that the work is being done, which is a cornerstone of this bill, is really important, but also that complaints system. And sometimes we see complaints in an entirely negative way, but complaints are also a way where we find out what needs to be fixed and to actually get on and fix it, and also recognising the really important position of the Office of the Children’s Commissioner, which would be extended to recognise the role around young people, not just in representing but also positively advocating for young people. And we’ve seen that with the recently departed Children’s Commissioner who did a great job, Judge Becroft.

This is a really good bill. I’m hopeful that the select committee will work positively, constructively, and improve it. I commend it to the House.

I rise on behalf of National as their member of Parliament for North Shore on the Oversight of Oranga Tamariki System and Children and Young People’s Commission Bill, first reading. As we have heard from fellow speakers this evening, National support this bill. We support this bill through the select committee, which is an important process within this Parliament, for this bill to be considered in order to be able to improve this bill considerably through that process. We’ve heard here this evening there are some 5,000 children that are within the care of the system. These are young, vulnerable children. These are children that have significant challenges in their life and their upbringing, and the importance of the State providing that protection for those young individuals—the future of individuals that will make a significant contribution in this country is so very important.

So National absolutely support the importance of this bill. We support the fact that there will be independent oversight provided in regards to this. I guess this also is important in terms of, you know, sadly, what we’ve seen in recent news and elements around that is the reality of some of the challenges for these young children across our country. The implications that, for some of them, sadly, happen in terms of the vulnerable positions that they’re put in in terms of their support arrangements and, again, reinforces the importance of an appropriate wellbeing and safety net around our young children.

I don’t think there is too much more to say here in regards to this bill. The National Party support it through to select committee and we look forward to participating with other members of this House in a constructive manner around that table to make this legislation as good as it can be. Thank you, Madam Speaker.

Thank you, Madam Speaker. This is a very important piece of legislation. For a very long time, the State care system hasn’t been very caring, especially towards Māori children—in fact, Māori children have been abused in the system, and for that reason there is a severe lack of trust in our Oranga Tamariki system. But, actually, reforming the system is part of the reason that I want to stand here and give this contribution today, because Māori need to have faith in our child welfare system—because, as I said before, it hasn’t historically done very well.

What I would like to point out is that there has been a group of key Māori leaders providing the ongoing guidance, direction, and support of this work, known as Te Kāhui. They’ve been guided by the Office for Māori Crown Relations - Te Arawhiti. They’ve also been supported by Te Puni Kōkiri, as well as the many reviews and many opinions of people of Aotearoa who have put forward their thoughts about how we could better create this system.

One of the best parts of this is that we’re going to be able to separate out some of those key functions of what has previously been left to just Oranga Tamariki to be able to do. Previous speakers have talked about it—the monitoring functions, the complaints and investigations functions, and, obviously, the role of advocacy via the Children’s Commissioner too.

This is an important piece of legislation. I know that the select committee will hear lots of stories from people that are at the front line doing this work every single day. It’s hard work, it’s gruelling work, but if we get it right, then we have the future to look forward to, which hopefully is a better future than the way that our children in State care have been treated in the past. For that reason, I commend it to the House.

The question is, That the Oversight of Oranga Tamariki System and Children and Young People’s Commission Bill be considered by the Social Services and Community Committee.

Motion agreed to.

Bill referred to the Social Services and Community Committee.