Oral Questions

1. to the Minister of Finance: What recent announcements has he made regarding economic support for businesses facing restrictions as a result of the Delta outbreak?

The Government has provided significant support to businesses and workers in response to the Delta COVID-19 outbreak. So far, we have paid out $4.8 billion approximately through the wage subsidy scheme and Resurgence Support Payment (RSP) since August when the outbreak began. We do know, however, that it has been particularly tough for those in Auckland, and, as part of the move to the new COVID-19 Protection Framework, we’ve announced an enhanced business support package to help businesses through this transition. The core of that is a significant boost to the Resurgence Support Payment, moving to fortnightly payments at double the current rate, and the first of these will open on 12 November. Currently, the RSP is a three-weekly payment of $1,500 per eligible business and $400 for each full-time employee up to a total of 50 full-time equivalents (FTEs) or $21,500. For the payments starting on 12 November, this will be $3,000 per eligible business and $800 per FTE up to 50 FTEs, making a maximum fortnightly payment of $43,000. The wage subsidy will continue to be available on the current criteria while areas of the country are still in alert level 3, and the cost of providing both the weekly RSP, as it effectively becomes, and the wage subsidy is estimated to be up to $940 million per fortnight through this transitional period.

💬 Dr Duncan Webb: Why has the Government decided to use the Resurgence Support Payment to provide assistance under the new COVID-19 Protection Framework?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: The decision was made to use the RSP because it’s the mechanism that gives the greatest flexibility. It’s also an existing mechanism, which means it can be implemented quickly. The RSP is now, effectively, targeting Auckland businesses, with payments going to Auckland having grown to 70 percent of the payment from 40 percent when it was first paid out in this outbreak. This enhanced support will be paid fortnightly until Auckland has been able to move into the COVID-19 Protection Framework.

💬 Dr Duncan Webb: What will happen to the economic supports when the new COVID19 Protection Framework is fully in place?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: Cabinet’s made in principle decisions on the financial supports that will become available when the framework takes effect, and the details of that will be confirmed next month, but as we said on Friday, some of those decisions we are able to announce now. The first of those is that a transition grant will be made available to support businesses, particularly those in Auckland, when they move into the new framework, and our planning is for this to be based on broadly similar criteria to the Resurgence Support Payment. Once the framework is fully operational across New Zealand, this will be the time to replace the current support schemes that we have with something that better reflects the new framework. We have said that, as businesses are able to operate as normal under the orange and green levels, there will not be across-the-board support. I will be proposing to Ministers financial support that targets the most affected businesses for when areas of the country are in red.

💬 Andrew Bayly: Thank you, Mr Speaker. Why didn’t he make the increased resurgence payment available immediately to cash-strapped businesses rather than make it three weeks before they can even apply?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: There is a Resurgence Support Payment opening for application this week, and so that happens on the 29th and then we move to the fortnightly payments as soon as possible after that, giving the effect of a weekly payment.

💬 David Seymour: Well, was the Minister aware that making the resurgence payment weekly was first floated by ACT on 6 September, and, if not, would he like to go on our mailing list so he can get some more good ideas for dealing with COVID?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: While I am deeply interested in the views of the member, I don’t follow each and every one of his press releases, and were I to have taken all of his advice over the last 20 months or so, I don’t think businesses in Auckland would’ve appreciated that.

Question No. 2—Prime Minister

2. to the Prime Minister: Does she stand by all of her Government’s statements and actions?

Yes. In particular, I stand by this Government’s announcement on Friday on our next step in our response to COVID-19. The COVID-19 Protection Framework will provide a pathway out of lockdown and will allow businesses and events to open to those who are vaccinated in New Zealand. By setting a target of 90 percent fully vaccinated across each of the 20 DHB regions, we’re balancing the need for New Zealand to return to some additional ways of life that we have not had for some time and do everything we can to ensure no one is left behind. We’re supporting this transition with up to $940 million per fortnight in our business boost package and $120 million to accelerate our Māori vaccination rates, but the responsibility, of course, lies with all of us to continue to do all we can to support one another to be vaccinated.

💬 Hon Judith Collins: What advice has she sought regarding the mental health impact of keeping Auckland under lockdown for at least another four weeks?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: Well, of course, the length of time that will be spent in level 3 restrictions is dependent on a number of things. Firstly, we have set a target of each of the DHBs there reaching 90 percent. I note this morning that we are just 11,000 vaccines shy of reaching that 90 percent target for first doses. So, of course, the quicker that that is achieved, the quicker our second doses and, of course, the quicker that those level 3 restrictions will be removed. I note the member herself has not proposed anything earlier than 1 December. The second thing that it is contingent on, of course, is the outbreak itself. We’ve still kept the step-downs available to us so that if we are able to ease in the meantime, we will continue to do so. To answer the member’s question on mental health, I receive a range of pieces of information, both contacts made to things like our Youthline—I’ve recently received a report from the Child and Youth Wellbeing unit on the impacts of lockdown on children and, of course, I do receive information from the chambers of commerce and the Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment, daily, on the hotline calls that they’re receiving. So we know, of course, the strain across the board that restrictions place on people.

💬 Hon Judith Collins: Does she accept that her Government’s inability to produce something as basic as proof of vaccination means a million vaccinated Aucklanders are still stuck in lockdown with no end in sight?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: No.

💬 Hon Judith Collins: Why didn’t she use the last 18 months to expand our ICU capacity, and is this failure the reason we now need a traffic light system?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: No.

💬 Hon Judith Collins: Do we currently have enough ICU capacity to manage COVID?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: Yes.

💬 Hon Judith Collins: Will she apologise for her slow vaccine roll-out and failure to prepare for an outbreak that caused thousands of small businesses to close?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: Of course, no one—no one—wants to have the impacts that COVID is having on our communities, whether it be the health of those who have experienced COVID, those who’ve experienced the loss of life within their families, or, indeed, the impacts on the economy. But relative to other countries, of which none have come away without an impact being felt, of all countries, New Zealand has fared amongst the best: some of the lowest cases in the OECD, lowest hospitalisations, lowest death rates, and an economy that has fared extraordinarily well, and that is because of the choices that we’ve made, and that will need to be the case going forward. Our ambition, through high vaccination rates, is to still minimise and protect the general population against the impacts of COVID-19, particularly when we know that even with a highly vaccinated population, if it’s not properly managed you can still have impacts on business and, of course, people’s lives.

💬 Hon Judith Collins: So how does the traffic light system announced last Friday interact with the Auckland roadmap steps system announced just 18 days earlier; isn’t it true the Government is just making it up as it goes along?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: Absolutely not, and if the member had listened to either the announcements on the day or even the reference I made in my answer just now, then that would have become clear. The traffic light system has been designed to work in the environment where you have a highly vaccinated population, because it does remove some of the things that we’ve used previously when we haven’t had the tools of vaccine. It, for instance, uses much more localised lockdowns if you have a situation with low vaccination rates in a population, but it does not use things like alert level 3, and so that is why it can only really be safely used in a highly vaccinated environment. In the meantime, as I’ve just said to the member, the step-downs continue to be available to us, but we assess those against both the outbreak as well as vaccination levels.

💬 Hon Judith Collins: How does she think the New Zealand economy is going to respond in the future to the 4.9 percent increase in inflation?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: Well, we’re not alone in having experienced that. The likes of Canada and others are seeing similar impacts, and of course, you can point to, in many ways, the impacts of COVID, particularly the pressure that it’s putting on supply chain. Most speculate, or many speculate, that this is not something that will be long term. But in the meantime, we need to do what we can to ensure that we are meeting the needs, particularly, of those lowest-income New Zealanders as they feel the impacts of COVID-related increases in the cost of living.

Question No. 3—COVID-19

3. to the Minister for COVID-19 Response: What recent announcements has the Government made on the management of COVID-19 in New Zealand?

Last week, the Prime Minister announced the new COVID-19 Protection Framework and shared the plan with New Zealanders that will help to keep us safe from COVID-19 into the future. The new protection framework sets a pathway forward that rewards the rapidly growing number of New Zealanders who have been vaccinated with more freedom to go about their lives safely. The simplified framework has three levels: green, orange, and red. Vaccine certificates will provide greater freedoms at each of the levels. There will be extra public health precautions built in at higher levels to minimise the impact of COVID-19 and suppress the spread of that virus. Our current alert level framework and an elimination strategy have kept us safe and our economy functioning while we got vaccinated, but now as more Kiwis are protected by the vaccine we need a new plan that moves away from lockdowns as the primary defence against the virus.

💬 Ginny Andersen: What will the new protection framework mean for people and businesses in New Zealand?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: For individual New Zealanders, it will mean more freedom. For businesses, it will mean being able to open up and get back to doing what they love doing with a greater degree of freedom. Businesses that choose to open to the unvaccinated will face greater restrictions in order to suppress the virus amongst those most likely to have it. Fully vaccinated people will be able to reconnect with their friends and their families, they’ll be able to go to bars and restaurants, and do the things they love with greater certainty and confidence.

💬 Ginny Andersen: When can New Zealanders expect to transition to the new framework?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: We’ve set a target of 90 percent fully vaccinated across each district health board region as the milestone to trigger moving the country into the new system. That target ensures a good regional spread across the country and it will help us to address equity issues within each region. Our modelling shows that having 90 percent of eligible people fully vaccinated provides a high level of coverage, and that will help us to keep New Zealanders safe, slow and control outbreaks, and assist public health authorities to do their jobs. Auckland will be able to move sooner; the plan provides a clear path for Auckland to move out of lockdown as soon as 90 percent of the eligible population are fully vaccinated across the three DHBs. There are around 11,000 vaccines to go for every DHB to hit the target for their 90 percent first doses in Auckland. When that turns into double digits, that’s when the new framework will kick in.

Question No. 4—Finance

4. to the Minister of Finance: What responsibility, if any, does the Government take for the Consumers Price Index reaching 4.9 percent in the September 2021 year?

Responsibility for the Consumers Price Index (CPI) is shared across different areas of Government depending on what aspect the member is referring to. For example, responsibility for keeping the CPI at a reasonable level over the medium term is part of the mandate of the Reserve Bank of New Zealand (RBNZ). The RBNZ has operational independence in the way they perform their role; however, I would note that they have tended to put more weight on measures of core inflation rather than risk over-reacting to transitory factors that might not be a good indication of the state of the domestic economy. However, if the member is asking whether Government decisions have led to recent increases in inflation, I would point out to the member that commodity price increases and global supply disruptions are affecting all economies around the world. This is evidenced by the August 2021 inflation across the OECD being at an annual rate of 4.3 percent.

💬 Hon Michael Woodhouse: Does he accept spending billions of dollars outside of Budget allowances and direct COVID support has pushed up inflation?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: What I’d accept is that the support that the Government has given to New Zealand businesses, workers, and communities has meant that we have had one of the strongest economic responses to COVID-19 at the same time as having one of the lowest mortality rates and hospitalisation rates.

💬 Hon Michael Woodhouse: Is he concerned that economic commentators are now predicting that inflation will get worse before it gets better, with price increases particularly notable in petrol, food, and housing?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: In all three of the areas that the member mentions there, there are global supply chain disruptions that are causing significant impacts. There is a large debate taking place among economists around the world as to the persistence or the permanence of inflation. Those supply chain disruptions are ones that we continue to work on, but they are, in fact, ones that are global.

💬 Hon Michael Woodhouse: Does he still believe the inflation increases for June and September will “wash out” as he said in July, and does he agree that when they do, even higher rates are likely to wash in?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: As I said, there is significant debate among economists around the world about the persistence or the permanence of these levels of inflation. That will emerge over time. What I do know is that on this side of the House, we remain committed to supporting New Zealanders through COVID-19.

💬 Hon Michael Woodhouse: Well, does he accept that the economy is not in a good position for many New Zealanders experiencing rent increases of up to 7.8 percent over the last year and wage increases that pale in comparison with inflation?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: Well, if we actually look at the data that is in the inflation statistics that is in the member’s primary question, I’d point out that the annual rent increases were 3.2 percent—not the number that the member gave—and 0.7 percent for the quarter. It is challenging for people at the moment in many parts of the economy. That’s why the Government has stepped up and supported them.

Question No. 5—Small Business

5. to the Minister for Small Business: Mālō ni, Mr Speaker. What announcements has he made about advice and mental wellbeing support to help Auckland businesses during the transition to the new COVID19 Protection Framework?

Last Friday, along with the Minister of Finance, I announced a $60 million package for business advice and mental health support to be made available to help Auckland small and medium sized enterprises (SMEs) through the transition period to the new COVID-19 Protection Framework. There are three parts of this package: firstly, a $20 million business advisory service, of up to $3,000 per business, with no co-payment from the business, to enable them to receive expert advice and support; secondly, $30 million in grants for SMEs to implement business advice, with up to $4,000 per business and, again, with no co-payment from the individual business. These two parts will be delivered by the Regional Business Partner Network run by Auckland Unlimited, the Auckland Council’s economic development agency. The third part is up to $10 million additional funding to support mental health and wellbeing initiatives for business owners and employees. This will be co-designed with the Auckland Chamber of Commerce and the Employers and Manufacturers Association.

💬 Barbara Edmonds: What are the benefits of this package?

💬 Hon STUART NASH: The package is what the Auckland business leaders and representatives told us they required to help deal with the uncertainties caused by the Delta outbreak. This package will help better position SMEs to seize future opportunities and productivity gains when restrictions reduce, and improve their ability to operate in the meantime. We estimate that up to 10,000 Auckland SMEs will be assisted by the business and advisory support and that up to 7,500 Auckland SMEs will be supported by the implementation assistance. By delivering the package through the Regional Business Partner Network run by Auckland Unlimited, the Government is partnering with existing proven providers on the ground so assistance can be delivered far sooner than if we had to start from scratch.

💬 Barbara Edmonds: What feedback has the Minister seen on this package?

💬 Hon STUART NASH: Brett O’Riley, the chief executive of the Employers and Manufacturers Association, has said—and I quote—“The $50m for the RBP to provide 10,000 businesses with mentoring and advice to help them recover and grow into the future is an excellent practical step to support our businesses and economy.” Michael Barnett, the chief executive of the Auckland Chamber of Commerce, has said—and I quote—“The $60 million package for the Regional Business Partner Programme including $10 million for mental health support, will be a lifeline for many and help build resilience and a recovery strategy.”

Question No. 6—Oceans and Fisheries

6. to the Minister for Oceans and Fisheries: What advice, if any, did Fisheries New Zealand provide him on potential risks to Māui dolphin from increasing the total allowable commercial catch for snapper off the West Coast of the North Island?

on behalf of the Minister for Oceans and Fisheries: I received advice from Fisheries New Zealand that extensive trawl and set netting prohibitions are in place to manage the risks of commercial and recreational fishing to Māui dolphins along the West Coast of the North Island. The measures are part of a suite of actions under a wider threat management plan, which include creating and extending set net bans and extending trawl closure areas. Together these provide a high degree of certainty that the current risk fishing has to Māui dolphin mortality is close to zero. If I receive evidence to the contrary, I can impose further restrictions. I also note that the rules include a provision allowing me to act immediately to impose further restrictions if a single dolphin is caught in the Māui dolphin habitat within the West Coast of the North Island.

💬 Hon Eugenie Sage: Does he stand by his statement to former Prime Minister Helen Clark that, “I don’t want to be part of a Government that oversees the extinction of a species.”, if so, why has he taken a decision that Fisheries New Zealand considers may increase the risk to Māui dolphin?

On behalf of the Minister for Oceans and Fisheries, I reiterate that the measures provide a high degree of certainty that the current risk fishing has to Māui dolphin mortality is close to zero. In addition, if I do receive evidence to the contrary, within the parameters, I can impose further restrictions.

💬 Hon Eugenie Sage: What advice, if any, has he sought from his ministerial colleague the Minister of Conservation about the latest Department of Conservation survey, which reportedly shows there may be just 54 Māui dolphins remaining, and will he consider further measures to protect critically endangered Māui dolphins from being caught and dying in fishing nets?

On behalf of the Minister for Oceans and Fisheries, I can confirm that I am in regular contact with the formidable Minister for Conservation and we engage closely in discussions about a range of issues. I’m aware that the new Māui dolphin estimate is 54, but, as said before, I am confident that the advice that I have received is that there is a high degree of certainty that there is currently a close to zero risk that fishing has to the Māui dolphin mortality rates, and if I do receive evidence to the contrary, I can impose further restrictions.

💬 Hon Eugenie Sage: Did the Minister receive any advice on whether the increase in allowable snapper catch and potential risk to Māui dolphins will affect New Zealand’s seafood exports to the United States in the light of Sea Shepherd’s court action in the US Court of International Trade?

On behalf of the Minister for Oceans and Fisheries, I don’t have any information to hand that can assist with that answer, but I’m happy to seek further information if she so requires.

💬 SPEAKER: I just want to check on that one, whether the Minister answering the question is saying that or is she saying that Mr Parker is saying that?

On behalf of Minister Parker, I don’t have any information to hand.

💬 SPEAKER: OK. I think I’ll interpret that as the Minister answering on behalf saying she does not have that information, but if the member wants to put it down.

Happy to assist.

💬 SPEAKER: Thank you.

💬 Hon Eugenie Sage: How does the Minister respond to the call of the International Union for Conservation of Nature to “urgently extend dolphin protection for Māui and Hector’s dolphin.”?

On behalf of the Minister for Oceans and Fisheries, I’ll reiterate that to date, we don’t have any information that has been provided that the dolphin mortality will increase. It is close to zero. I have the ability to make amendments and impose further restrictions if there is any evidence to the contrary that this is indeed required.

Question No. 7—COVID-19 Response

7. to the Minister for COVID-19 Response: On what dates, if ever, did Cabinet authorise the development of COVID-19 vaccination certificates, and on what date will vaccination certificates be available for New Zealanders?

Ministers have been considering formally introducing a vaccination certificate since the beginning of the year. Cabinet formally authorised the development of a COVID-19 vaccination certification on 5 July, as part of the reconnecting New Zealand work which was announced in early August. Since then, we’ve been working through a variety of details and options around what a vaccine certificate might look like in New Zealand. I expect that vaccination certificates will be available from mid to late November.

💬 Chris Bishop: Why did it take the Cabinet until 5 July to authorise the development of vaccination certificates?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: Up until that point, the focus of the vaccination certification work was primarily on the international border and on making sure that people could validate their vaccination records for the purposes of international travel. The work around considering how a vaccination certificate regime could be used domestically started before July, but it was formally noted by Cabinet in July.

💬 Chris Bishop: Would a vaccination certificate regime be in place now if the Government had moved earlier than 5 July to authorise the development of a domestic vaccination certificate regime?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: The development of vaccination records and how people can access vaccination records has been ongoing throughout the year. I would note that the IT systems that that relies on were the very IT systems the member confidentially predicted in the House were going to be a flop—like Book My Vaccine and the COVID Immunisation Register. They have been hugely successful, and I have absolute confidence that the team developing this will produce a very successful vaccination certificate system, as well.

💬 Chris Bishop: Does he agree with the Deputy Prime Minister, who stated this morning that should an eligible area reach 90 percent of double-dose vaccination before mid-November, “If in the worst of all worlds, if we had to, we could use a paper-based system for a period of time”?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: People can access their vaccination records now. They can go and download them off the internet right now if they wish to do that, and if they wish to print them out to show other people that they have been vaccinated, they can access that now. But one of the issues is that people want to know that they have been validated, and so making sure there’s a technological solution available that respects people’s privacy and that allows for digital vaccination certificates to be validated is one of the pieces of work that is now in its final stages. Of course, though, one of the things that has to be resolved, and that did need to be resolved before this system could go live and be finalised, is exactly how they would be used. I can say, on this side of the House, we’re very clear on how vaccine certificates will be used.

💬 Rt Hon Jacinda Ardern: Can the Minister confirm that some countries, throughout the use of vaccination certificates, have used a paper-based model, but what the Government is working to develop enables an app to be used for the purposes of scanning and a quick response code certification that is an accurate vaccination certificate, so enables large-scale events to use them much more smoothly?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: Yes, I can, in fact, confirm that. Many other countries’ vaccination certificate regimes aren’t anything more sophisticated than the little card that people get when they go to be vaccinated. Our system will be significantly more advanced than that, and it will allow for the validation of someone’s vaccine record. It would help to prevent vaccination fraud, in the sense of people passing off that they have been vaccinated, when they haven’t been. Those things are important. People have the ability to produce evidence to show that they have been vaccinated now. Some people use the little vaccine cards already. And people can download their records off the internet today if they wish to.

💬 Chris Bishop: Is he comfortable with every country in the OECD, plus Cuba and Burkina Faso, having a vaccination certificate available right now, and New Zealand not?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: Well, if the member’s setting a very low threshold for what a vaccine certificate is—such as the little blue card that people get after they have been vaccinated being the equivalent of a vaccine certificate—then he’s welcome to make that claim. But that is about as sophisticated as many of those systems get. We’re developing a system that will be a lot more robust, that will stop people ripping off the system and claiming they’ve been vaccinated, when they are not. One of the things that we’ve been working through, as I just told the member, is being very clear on where vaccine certificates will be used and where they won’t be, and on this side of the House we have clear answers to those questions.

💬 David Seymour: Were all of the parameters of the vaccine certificate decided by Cabinet on 5 July, and, if not, when did Cabinet last meet to make decisions about the parameters of the vaccine certificate to be contracted out?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: It depends what the member is talking about. If he’s talking about the IT systems, those answers were dealt with some time ago; I’m happy to come back to him with a specific date. If it depends on how vaccine certificates will be applied, Cabinet is still working its way through that process. That will almost certainly involve having to bring legislation to the House. I look forward to the member’s support for that legislation, given the previous encouragement that he has given the Government, in this House, around issues around vaccine mandates.

Question No. 8—Health (Māori Health)

8. to the Associate Minister of Health (Māori Health): What recent announcement has he made about supporting the acceleration of Māori vaccination rates and supporting Māori communities to prepare for the implementation of the new COVID-19 Protection Framework?

💬 Hon Member: He said it was Māori’s fault.

💬 Hon Member: What was that?

💬 Hon Member: He said it was Māori’s fault. He was on TV saying it.

Is that another supplementary? Thank you, Mr Speaker. Alongside the Minister for—

💬 SPEAKER: Order! Order! It’s pretty hard to get a valid interjection before a member starts an answer.

💬 Hon Member: But I did.

💬 SPEAKER: Well, I’m not sure that the member did at all, and he’s testing me.

💬 Hon PEENI HENARE: Thank you, Mr Speaker. Alongside the Minister for Māori Crown Relations: Te Arawhiti, Kelvin Davis, and the Minister for Māori Development, Willie Jackson, we announced a further $120 million to establish a Māori Communities COVID-19 Fund, that supports Māori, iwi, and community organisations and providers to accelerate their responses and plans and to build resilience ahead of the planned shift to the new COVID-19 Protection Framework across two phases. Phase one will look to accelerate vaccine uptake amongst Māori in a very targeted way, and phase two will look to build whānau and community resilience, and we expect to do this alongside iwi, hapū, whānau, and communities.

Tāmati Coffey: How does this funding announcement align with the new COVID-19 Protection Framework?

💬 Hon PEENI HENARE: The introduction of the Government’s new COVID-19 Protection Framework will increasingly rely on locally led responses to COVID-19 events. Māori COVID-19 vaccination rates need to increase within each DHB as we look to reach 90 percent coverage. Within this context, additional resources are needed to put extra efforts and incentives to our current approaches, led by our Māori leaders, providers, and community groups. As we’ve travelled across the country and my colleagues have heard firsthand experience from our communities, it is important that these extra funds go towards the COVID-19 efforts. Phase two of the Māori Communities COVID-19 Fund will support the efforts to increase Māori vaccination rates and empower Māori to prepare for and lead an effective and safe transition. The timing of this announcement is also important, because, as we have seen through the COVID-19 lockdowns across 2020 and 2021, Māori whānau and communities often also have compromised resilience due to enduring economic hardships.

Tāmati Coffey: How can iwi, Māori providers, and Māori communities access this funding?

💬 Hon PEENI HENARE: Access to funding for phase one is now open from today to the end of the year. The fund targets Māori and iwi community organisations, and we expect groups already engaged in vaccination mobilisation and outreach activities through Te Puni Kōkiri, the Ministry of Health (MoH), and Te Arawhiti will be interested in accessing funding to maintain and build momentum, and we will work with them in the first instance. However, we will also look to work with other groups with funding proposals. Information on how to access the fund will be available on the Te Puni Kōkiri website, Te Arawhiti website, and the MoH website. Access to funding for phase two is expected to be available in November 2021. This fund will support Māori-, iwi-, and hapū-led communities to respond to the new COVID-19 Protection Framework, which in some cases will involve adapting and implementing existing pandemic response plans and resilience planning, and more information on how to access this fund will become available before November 2021.

Question No. 9—Prime Minister

9. to the Prime Minister: Does she stand by all of her statements and actions?

Yes. In particular, I stand by my statement that “The most important thing people can do to prevent themselves, children and vulnerable people getting COVID is to get vaccinated. However, it’s important we have medicines to help those who pick up the virus to avoid having to go to hospital.” That’s why I stand by the Government’s decision to ring-fence funding for the purchase of COVID-19 therapeutics, and I welcome the decision by Pharmac to enter an agreement to purchase 60,000 doses of an antiviral molnupiravir. Interim evidence from clinical trials suggests this drug may halve hospitalisations and deaths from COVID-19 and could play a central role in the treatment of mild to moderate cases of the disease in the future. As we evolve in our response to the Delta variant, I’m pleased that we have one more highly promising tool to add to our tool kit.

💬 David Seymour: Does she stand by her statement, “We have looked at all of the evidence, talked to experts, looked at modelling for our situation, and set a target of 90 percent fully vaccinated for each DHB in New Zealand.”; and, if so, has she received any modelling on what day that 90 percent target in every DHB is likely to be reached?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: To answer the first half the question, yes. The second half of the question—it’s obviously easier to make predictions based on those DHBs that are closer to the 90 percent on their first dose. So, obviously, with Auckland, there’s been some suggestion, of course, that it could be late November, early December. As I just said today, on Friday, we were 16,000 doses away from hitting the 90 percent for first dose. That’s now down to 11,000. So, as you can see, Auckland could hit that first dose target as early as this week. And then obviously, if you follow on with the three weeks for the second dose, then you can see the likely time frames.

💬 David Seymour: Why didn’t the Prime Minister answer the question about the last DHBs to reach 90 percent full vaccination since her policy requires the whole country to wait for the last, not the first?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: Because the member misunderstands. We have, of course, said that for Auckland, they will shift once those three DHBs—and that’s because that’s possible. And that was very clear in the announcement: Auckland will go first once the three DHBs within Auckland reach that target, and that’s because there’s a hard border around Auckland that enables that. The second reason is, as I’ve already outlined, for other DHBs, it’s not as easy to make a prediction at this stage, but, of course, you can make some assumptions that notifying that the use of things like vaccine certificates may incentivise extra uptake. The other point that I would make is for those other parts of the country outside the Waikato region—obviously, they’re in level 2 at the moment; very different circumstances than what Auckland is living with. But my very clear message to them would be if we do have cases in those communities, while we have lower vaccination rates, we will still have to use more blanket restrictions. We want to be able to use the traffic light framework. The safest way to do that is to get vaccination rates up to the targets that have been set.

💬 David Seymour: Is there any limit on how far past 1 December the Prime Minister is prepared to keep Auckland or the rest of New Zealand locked down; and if so, how long is it?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: Again, I would highlight to the member that the majority of the country is actually in level 2. Of course, we have a very specific eye on trying to move Auckland as quickly as possible, and they, obviously, are within the range of being able to do that, you know, within possibly even three to four weeks. Again, we want to make sure that we’re providing all the support we can to support the uptake of vaccination there and, in the meantime, we have also kept on the table the step-downs for Auckland as well so they’re not totally reliant on that shift. The final thing I’d say is Cabinet has said we’ll have a check-in on 29 November to assess the progress of both the Auckland DHBs, if they have not already reached the target, but also the rest of the country.

💬 David Seymour: Has she received any modelling on the level of vaccination required in the community before it is safe for managed isolation and quarantine (MIQ) to be shortened or skipped altogether in favour of home isolation for pre-departure tested, fully vaccinated Kiwis returning from overseas?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: The modelling hasn’t tended to get into that level of specificity, but what you will have seen from the modelling that’s been released to date is that they all assume some level of check at the border that goes beyond just a pre-departure test. So even Te Pūnaha Matatini’s modelling does include ongoing restrictions at the border to try and prevent the ongoing seeding of cases in the community, even when there are cases already within that community. And that’s just to stop the prevalence or the growth of outbreaks. We have already said, though, that as part of the reconnecting New Zealand work, we would move to shortened MIQ, we would move to self-isolation. We are trialling self-isolation over the coming weeks, and that enables us to work through some of the logistical challenges of ensuring that people are able to safely move from the airport to their homes without putting others at risk, but with a view to being able to use that tool more widely in the future.

💬 David Seymour: Has she had any communications about travelling to Europe herself in the coming weeks; and does she anticipate she’ll be able to take advantage of a shortened MIQ stay or home isolate by the time she returns?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: The decisions that we make on MIQ are made for the safety of New Zealand and for the context of all New Zealanders, not for any one individual.

Question No. 10—Local Government

10. to the Minister of Local Government: Will councils be informed of the proportion of ownership and control they would have of the water entities that would be established by the Three Waters reforms; if not, why not?

on behalf of the Minister of Local Government: The Government has been engaging with local government on the three waters proposals for some considerable time, and also on the governance arrangements as part of that, and we will continue to do so. The Government’s proposal is that local authorities are the owners of the entities on behalf of their communities. This proposal also includes legislative safeguards to ensure that these entities stay in public ownership.

💬 Nicola Willis: How much of the proposed entity A would Auckland Council own and therefore Auckland ratepayers have control over?

On behalf of the Minister, I don’t have the specific percentages in front of me but what I can say is that local authorities will be the owners collectively on behalf of their communities. It is also very important for us on this side of the House to make sure we protect the public ownership of these entities lest the National Party ever get in Government and try and hock them off.

💬 Nicola Willis: How would ratepayers have direct influence over the water entities in the way they do now over their elected councils when in a typical entity up to 20 councils would be represented by just six seats on a regional representative group?

On behalf of the Minister, the member has answered her own question, that the regional representative group will cover the councils. It will also cover mana whenua in the area. The important thing for the member to consider here is whether or not she thinks that the way water assets in New Zealand have been managed over previous decades is adequate, and I think the member, of all people, would realise that water assets in New Zealand have not been well managed. The status quo is not working. If we stick to the status quo it will cost thousands of dollars on ratepayers, and the member just might want to think about the good people of Wellington who want their water to be better than it is now.

Brooke van Velden: Were councils informed about the Resource Management (Enabling Housing Supply and Other Matters) Amendment Bill before it was announced, and, if not, did the National Party housing spokesperson lobby her to ensure they were informed?

💬 SPEAKER: I think that might be described as a nice try but not a proper supplementary.

💬 David Seymour: Point of order, Mr Speaker. If a question is asked about the practice of the Government informing local government, how is it not a valid question to put that in context and ask what the practice of informing local government normally is? How is that not a valid question?

💬 SPEAKER: If the question was about the relationship generally between the Government and local government, then it is possible that that supplementary could have been worked in. This question was about water.

💬 Nicola Willis: Will the Minister, as rumoured, announce plans this week to legislate to require all local authorities to give up their water assets for a “nationwide all-in model”, as preferred by her Government?

💬 Hon Chris Hipkins: Point of order, Mr Speaker. Is rumour now adequate authentication of material for the purposes of supplementary questions?

💬 SPEAKER: If I thought it was necessary for the substance of the question, then the answer would have been no. But, actually, it was a superfluous, unnecessary addition that didn’t actually affect the sense of the question and therefore I chose not to be officious and rule it out. There’s a new liberal, reasonable me.

On behalf of the Minister, the Government continues to work with local government around making sure that we involve as many councils as possible as we can in this proposal, and when it comes to rumours, if I believed all of the rumours that I’ve heard around Wellington, the member would already be the leader of the National Party.

💬 Hon Eugenie Sage: Is the Government considering having more than four entities to provide better community-of-interest representation?

On behalf of the Minister, we have put out our proposal for the four entities. We believe that that is the best aggregation of those assets to provide New Zealanders with the kind of water infrastructure that they need and deserve.

💬 Hon James Shaw: Given the National Party’s concern about the Government seizing the assets of local government, would the Government consider inviting the National Party to help to create a supermajority vote to ensure that that legislation can’t be overturned and that those assets do actually stay in the hands of local government?

On behalf of the Minister, I am very confident that the legislative proposals that we have ensure that public ownership is guaranteed. I would invite the National Party to vote for that and reject their decades-long attachment to asset sales.

Question No. 11—Conservation

11. to the Minister of Conservation: What recent announcement has she made regarding Jobs for Nature funding for the Sustainable Business Network?

More good news, with respect to Jobs for Nature. Last week, I announced further Government support for New Zealand’s longest-standing sustainable business organisation, the Sustainable Business Network, to open up opportunities for workers impacted by COVID-19 to jumpstart a nature-based career. The Partnering to Plant Aotearoa project involves collaboration with local community groups to undertake small-scale but valuable ecological restoration, supporting projects which provide positive impacts on conservation, keep boots on the ground, and aid in our economic recovery is what our Jobs for Nature programme is all about.

💬 Rachel Boyack: What has the Partnering to Plant Aotearoa project achieved to date?

💬 Hon KIRITAPU ALLAN: Since September 2020, the three earlier phases of the project have delivered $2.5 million in Jobs for Nature funding to 10 community-based conservation partners across the country, including in areas where there were significant jobs losses. More than 120 people have been employed through the project to date, connecting businesses struggling to keep their staff employed, as well as unemployed workers, to nature-based employment opportunities.

💬 Rachel Boyack: What will the next phase of the project aim to achieve?

💬 Hon KIRITAPU ALLAN: Mr Speaker, fantastic question. A further $2.5 million in Jobs for Nature funding announced last week—

💬 SPEAKER: It almost got ruled out.

💬 Hon KIRITAPU ALLAN: Well I think it’s—yes. Thank you, Mr Speaker. A further $2.5 million in Jobs for Nature funding announced last week will allow the Sustainable Business Network to provide two more partner groups on board, opening up 60 jobs across the country, delivering formal training outcomes, and generating more than 53,000 hours of conservation work. This work includes extensive planting, weeding, and fencing to improve habitat and food sources for native species—

💬 SPEAKER: Enough.

Question No. 12—Health (Māori Health)

12. to the Associate Minister of Health (Māori Health): Is he satisfied that Māori health providers and commissioning agents have been well positioned to support the roll-out of the COVID-19 response for Māori?

Yes.

💬 Harete Hipango: Knowing that COVID first struck 18 months ago, why did the Minister wait eight months to secure accelerant funding to lift Māori vaccination rates rather than at the beginning of the vaccination roll-out, as advised to him by officials?

💬 Hon PEENI HENARE: To be very clear, we’re talking about two different things here, and I can understand how the member might have got this wrong. So, if I can, let me be quite clear: the COVID response plan is the broader plan. That is the plan that, since the start of the pandemic, we have thrown significant support into the response that’s led by Māori. With respect to the COVID Māori vaccine plan, that was the plan that was announced in the beginning of March of this year, and since that one announcement, we have made two further announcements to continue to support the Māori vaccine roll-out.

💬 Harete Hipango: So, as the Minister says that the Government has thrown—thrown—significant support to Māori, if it was so good, why are Māori vaccination rates lagging?

💬 Hon PEENI HENARE: As I’ve travelled around to a number of DHBs and Māori health providers, it’s now quite clear that the Māori communities we need to reach now to bring up Māori vaccination rates are communities that might not be connected to Māori health providers, acknowledging that 86 percent of Māori actually go through their GPs and primary health organisations (PHOs) and not Māori health providers. Secondly, many of them are in rural, remote, isolated areas, which means that in order to reach them, we must give more support, because if we actually supported our Māori health providers on a per-jab basis, then they wouldn’t be able to meet the overheads to get into the rural, remote communities to reach the community that we’re trying to target over the coming weeks.

💬 Hon Kiritapu Allan: On the basis of the conversations that the Minister had going around the country, and in order to support those rural and remote communities, what support has he provided to Māori providers like Ngāti Porou Hauora to support such initiatives?

💬 Hon PEENI HENARE: I thank the member for the question. To support the already free mobile clinics that are utilised on Te Tai Rāwhiti, over the past week, working alongside the DHB and Māori health providers, proud to announce that more support for mobile clinics across Te Tai Rāwhiti has been expedited. In fact, my understanding is that the wheels of those clinics will be hitting the ground in the next 24 hours.

💬 Harete Hipango: So why did the Ministry of Health refuse to give Māori health providers data that would’ve helped them increase Māori vaccination rates and keep the wheels of that bus going on?

💬 Hon PEENI HENARE: The situation with data is that through the Ministry of Health, we are already providing quite a granular data set to Māori health providers. We are supported by PHOs and GPs to continue to give data, and good data, to Māori health providers so that they can reach those communities that we’re finding it hard to engage with. But I will say this: a number of Māori health providers in this country have actually acknowledged something that we’ve all come to realise now, and that is that even they have lost connection with a number of these communities over many years. They are keen to re-engage, and we’re keen to support them to do that.