Oral Questions

1. to the Prime Minister: Does she stand by all of her Government’s statements and actions?

Yes. I particularly stand by our decision to ensure New Zealanders receive a full course of COVID-19 vaccine in the clinically recommended time frame, which is why today we’ve announced that over half a million New Zealanders are fully vaccinated against COVID-19. We must remain vigilant, especially in the face of variants of concern, but this Government’s actions continue to support our recovery but also continue to support the health of New Zealanders.

💬 Hon Judith Collins: Can she confirm her Government’s method for detecting if emergency housing applicants are gang members is, as her Minister for social development said yesterday, to ask: “It’s on the form.”; and does she think a gang member will answer this truthfully?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: As I said yesterday, I think the most important thing that we need to focus on is ways that we can get around the original design of the use of motels by the last Government, which did not give us the flexibility to ensure that we were placing with care children against those who may have other housing needs, and so we’re working hard to do a redesign of the system that allows for that. Fully contracting entire facilities and case-managing in that way, as we’re doing in Rotorua, is, I think, a model for how we may do things in the future. But, again, our focus is on housing people and housing them safely, and, of course, we take into account who they are housed alongside.

💬 Hon Judith Collins: Why is her Government not simply using information from the Gang Intelligence Centre to identify gang members and prevent 4,000 children living alongside gang members, four years after she took office?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: Again, I would point to the fact that we are working very hard to ensure that when we are placing people, we are doing so safely. Again, if the member wishes to criticise the way in which our emergency housing system is operating as it relates to motels, her Government was the first one to design it. So if she believes that it’s not utilising other agencies, then that, I would put to the member, is because of the way in which it was first established.

💬 Hon Judith Collins: What does she say to the 4,000 children currently growing up in dangerous motels who were told when she became Prime Minister of New Zealand four years ago that New Zealand would be the best place in the world to be a child?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: I’d point to the fact that there are 43,000 fewer children living in poverty, under the housing cost measure, because of this Government. I would point to the indexation of benefits, the most significant benefit increases since benefits were established, the fact that we changed the way the in-work tax credit applies, that we established the BestStart payment, the reinstatement around the training incentive allowance—we’ve seen some of the most fundamental reforms to our benefits system for decades, and I am very proud of that. Does that mean the work is done? No. We will continue to build houses as fast as we can to redress the issues that have been building over many decades, including the decade in which that member was in Government.

💬 David Seymour: How many doses of the Janssen COVID-19 vaccine does the Government have ordered, and when will they be onshore in New Zealand?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: The Janssen vaccine was, obviously, only approved by Medsafe today. So there is still a decision to use—a process that needs to go through Cabinet. My understanding is that those orders are in the vicinity of 2 million. But, again, I’d say to the member that Cabinet needs to make decisions around the usage of those vaccines, but they do provide choices and opportunities for New Zealand.

💬 Hon Judith Collins: Can she commit to have no children living in motels with gang members by this Christmas, four years after she took office?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: I don’t want any children living in motels at all, and that, in fact, is the goal of this Government. We have of course, over the last quarter, housed 1,700 people from the register, and when you look at the churn over many quarters, in the December quarter, we’d housed 2,100; the September quarter, 1,800; and then across the March quarter—again, before that—1,860. We continue to house people as quickly as we can while we build houses and create transitional housing places, but I cannot tell the member how long it will take us to solve the mess she left us.

💬 Hon Judith Collins: How much longer does she anticipate mental health workers will be forced to care for some of the most vulnerable patients in the country in clinically unsafe conditions, as stated by the Association of Salaried Medical Specialists?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: Of course, I can only make assumptions about what the member—or, indeed, the referral there that’s been made to clinically unsafe environments. But I can make an assumption, having seen some of those environments myself across, for instance, the Waikato or across Mid-Central, that those are facilities that we are working to rebuild. That includes Waikato, Lakes, Mid-Central, a refurbishment at Tai Rāwhiti, and Waitematā, and, of course, that comes out of the Budget funding that we put in only in 2019.

Question No. 2—Finance

2. to the Minister of Finance: What recent reports has he seen on the New Zealand economy?

The primary sector is continuing to support and secure the recovery. The ANZ Commodity Price Index, which was released yesterday, rose by 0.8 percent in June—the ninth successive monthly increase—to leave the index at a record high. The gains were broad-based, with producers benefiting from higher prices as global demand for New Zealand’s commodities remains robust. Forestry extended its record highs, rising by 3.6 percent in June, while meat and fibre rose 1.8 percent, and horticulture gained 4.3 percent. Dairy prices did ease by 1.5 percent, but they are still 35 percent higher than they were a year ago. When returns to producers are converted back to New Zealand dollars, the overall index rose by 2.3 percent. Nevertheless, our producers are operating in a volatile market, reflecting the impact of the pandemic.

💬 Helen White: What other reports has he seen on the economy?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: Data released today shows an increase in advertised job vacancies. TradeMe’s latest jobs data shows the site recorded—

💬 Andrew Bayly: That’s because they can’t get people.

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: No, your job hasn’t been advertised yet, Mr Bayly, but it will be soon. TradeMe’s latest jobs data shows the site recorded its highest number of jobs listed ever in the June quarter, increasing by 25 percent compared with the same period in 2019, prior to COVID. It now has more than 80,000 jobs being advertised. The largest increases were in hospitality and tourism, which rose by 56 percent; manufacturing and operations up 52 percent; and construction and roading up 46 percent. TradeMe says the listings did not look to be slowing down, and this shows just how strong and quickly the job market has bounced back.

💬 Helen White: What reports has he seen of the impact of the economy on consumer confidence?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: The latest ANZ-Roy Morgan Consumer Confidence index shows consumer confidence remains steady. The index stood at 114 in June, a little under its historical average of 120. The proportion of people who believe it is a good time to buy a major household item, which is a key retail indicator of confidence, rose 3 points to 22. Respondents were more positive about their own financial position: jumping seven points to 14 percent, its strongest post-COVID level. The survey does, however, show that consumers remain cautious about the future, which is completely understandable in the context of the COVID-19 pandemic.

Question No. 3—Finance

3. to the Minister of Finance: What actions, if any, does the Government intend to take in response to the Treasury report entitled He Tirohanga Mokopuna 2021: Consultation on the draft content of the Treasury’s combined Statement on the Long-term Fiscal Position and Long-term Insights Briefing?

Given that there is a consultation under way on a draft document, the initial action that I am taking is to read it and consider the feedback on it once it comes in. In terms of the issues raised within the report, the Government is already taking action to provide security and certainty to New Zealanders.

💬 Hon Michael Woodhouse: Does the report’s warnings about long-term debt projections cause him to reconsider spending decisions on projects such as the $785 million cycling bridge across Waitematā Harbour?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: I note that the Treasury in the report do not express any concern about the current level of debt that the Government has, nor is this report about current projects.

💬 Hon Michael Woodhouse: Will he commit to reductions in structural spending from the COVID-19 Response and Recovery Fund (CRRF) that have nothing to do with COVID response and recovery?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: We will continue to use the COVID-19 Response and Recovery Fund for the words that are in the name of the fund—response and recovery—because that is what it’s for. I repeat my earlier answer: the Treasury’s report that this question is based on is not about the current spending, with which Treasury is comfortable.

💬 Hon Michael Woodhouse: What does spending $710 million on three waters reform and the online pornography ad campaign have to do with COVID-19?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: I think it would be pretty obvious to most New Zealanders that making sure we have an efficient system and effective system for the management of water which helps create jobs and lowers costs on New Zealanders is something that we’d welcome. Clearly, on the other side of the House, there is no interest whatsoever in making sure that our water system works well.

💬 Hon Chris Hipkins: Has the Minister of Finance seen any alternative proposals for the use of the CRRF funding, such as spending all of the funding that was left on roads?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: Yes, I actually have done that, and, in fact, that was a document that I do believe was produced by the Hon Paul Goldsmith, which I think he dropped on the floor at one stage. But it’s still probably there, if members across the House want to find it.

💬 Hon Michael Woodhouse: Has he had a discussion with Treasury officials about whether the current net debt to GDP limit could be increased, given their concerns about spending?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: As outlined by the Treasury secretary in the speech that she recently gave, she does believe that it is time to have a discussion now about New Zealand’s debt levels. What we do know is that this is a Government that took our net debt under 20 percent of GDP, something that the National Party was never able to achieve. We now have debt at a higher level because of COVID, but it is forecast to reduce.

Question No. 4—Housing

4. to the Minister of Housing: What announcements has she made about transitional housing in Wellington?

Yesterday, I announced the opening of the capital’s largest transitional housing facility, and also the biggest outside of Auckland: Wellington City Mission Te Pā Pori. The Government is providing $15 million over three years in support of these refurbished apartments and the people being housed to help them get back on their feet. This builds on the momentum of our transitional housing programme by adding up to another 100 additional beds to our stock as we deliver over 18,000 new public and transitional housing places by 2024. There is much more work to do, but the opening of this facility is another important milestone on our path to achieving that goal.

💬 Paul Eagle: How does this contribute to the Government’s ambitions for transitional housing?

💬 Hon Dr MEGAN WOODS: We are committed to housing the people who need the most support through our public and transitional housing plan, and we’ve made good progress to date. When we came into Government, there were 1,718 transitional housing places. In the 3½ years we’ve been in Government, we have delivered 2,553 new transitional housing places, more than doubling the number of places available to 4,271. This Government continues to build momentum on our public and transitional housing plan, and the opening of this facility is another important step on that pathway.

💬 Paul Eagle: Why is it important that the Government partner with organisations like the Wellington City Mission?

💬 Hon Dr MEGAN WOODS: We know that the key to bringing on more public and transitional housing is strong leadership from central government in partnership with groups like the Wellington City Mission and other community housing partners. Since coming into office, the Government has spent $471.6 million for accommodation and support services in partnership with these organisations. Having a safe and secure place to stay, with provision of the right support services from these organisations, is crucial to ensuring that people can transition to long-term suitable housing.

Question No. 5—Housing (Māori Housing)

5. to the Associate Minister of Housing (Māori Housing): How many houses are projected to be built, and by when, at the land at Ihumātao?

Kia ora, Mr Speaker. A memorandum of understanding—he pūmautanga—has been signed by the Kīngitanga, the Crown, and Auckland Council which sets out how parties will work together to decide the future of the land, and I do not wish to pre-empt this process.

💬 Hon Member: So nothing will ever happen.

💬 Hon PEENI HENARE: It is important to note—the member might want to listen; this is a good koha—that parties have committed that there will be housing on the site, and we are continuing to work through this process.

Brooke van Velden: Does the Minister believe it is acceptable that, over six months on from the Government signing a memorandum of understanding with Kīngitanga and Auckland Council for the land at Ihumātao, the Minister of Housing has not met with either Kīngitanga or Auckland Council?

💬 Hon PEENI HENARE: We make no apology for taking the time to get this right—[Interruption] That side might want to listen. The Treaty of Waitangi, over 180 years—it’s taken a long time to come to where we are now. If that member is referring directly to the land at Ihumātao, I can reassure that member that I’ve met with the Kīngitanga, I have met with those who are out at the ahikā out at Ihumātao, and I have also met with the council in the time that I’ve been responsible for Māori housing.

Brooke van Velden: Can he confirm that the land will still be used for housing, as was agreed to and announced on the signing of the memorandum of understanding between the Government, Kīngitanga, and Auckland Council?

💬 David Seymour: Point of order, Mr Speaker. It may just be me, but I wasn’t clear if the Minister was answering—actually, Mr Speaker, I’ve made a mistake and I shouldn’t have raised this point of order. I’m very sorry.

💬 Hon PEENI HENARE: Yes.

Brooke van Velden: Can he confirm, over six months on from the signing of the memorandum of understanding, that the steering committee has been formed?

💬 Hon PEENI HENARE: Right now, with respect to he pūmautanga, we are working with the Kīngitanga and ngā ahikā to establish the rōpū whakahaere.

Brooke van Velden: When can we expect the steering committee, consisting of six representatives representing or supporting the Crown and Kīngitanga, to be formed?

💬 Hon PEENI HENARE: I have it on the good authority of my colleague the Hon Willie Jackson to my right here that we will be looking to push this kaupapa along, and my expectation is that in the very near future we will have an announcement.

Brooke van Velden: How many houses can be built at the land at Ihumātao, given the agreement the Government has signed and council zoning?

💬 Hon PEENI HENARE: I refer back to my first answer to the primary question, which actually establishes that he pūmautanga to sit down together to establish the use of that land, which the expectation of the Government is part of it will be for housing.

Brooke van Velden: Does he know of any private developers that have spent $30 million and have produced no plans for housing?

💬 Hon PEENI HENARE: No.

Question No. 6—Social Development and Employment

6. to the Minister for Social Development and Employment: What recent expansions has she launched to support more graduates into employment?

Last night, I had the pleasure of hosting the launch of the Student Job Search expansion. The expansion follows investment by the Ministry of Social Development to support Student Job Search to create a new team. This team will be solely focused on working with graduates to connect them with employers and place them in permanent employment. This expansion boosts Student Job Search’s focus on helping students transition from study into full-time employment and supporting employers to scale up their businesses. The Government is committed to securing our recovery, which is why we’re continuing to invest in employment products and services that support people into sustainable and meaningful jobs.

💬 Anahila Kanongata’a-Suisuiki: Why has Student Job Search been expanded?

💬 Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: The expansion is a response to a growth in inquiries from students looking for permanent work after graduating from study in light of COVID19. It signals a shift in the mahi of Student Job Search, which has traditionally been a place that tertiary students can go to find part-time work and odd jobs while they study. As part of the expansion, they’ve been working closely with Te Mana Ākonga and Tauira Pasifika. This has seen an increase in Māori and Pacific registration rates of 14.8 percent. The expansion means Student Job Search can continue to advocate for students after they’ve graduated. By championing their skills and qualifications and preparing them for job interviews, this will help and encourage them to make the most of the opportunities available.

💬 Anahila Kanongata’a-Suisuiki: What impact has Student Job Search had on supporting students and graduates to get employed?

💬 Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: Student Job Search is a household name. It has helped to place students into 159,798 jobs for 61,886 New Zealand employers since 2015—that’s more than 100 jobs each working day. Over the last three months, Student Job Search has secured 3,742 full-time roles for students—a 200 percent increase on previous years. The quality of the jobs they are sourcing has also drastically increased, with the average student earnings per job increasing by 46 percent since May 2020. I’m pleased that this expansion will support Student Job Search to maximise its reach and offerings, making a worthwhile impact in the lives of our young people. They were so excited that this question was being asked about Student Job Search today, they are here in the House, and I acknowledge them for their mahi.

💬 SPEAKER: Order! The member knows, or should know, that she should not refer to people in the gallery.

Question No. 7—Social Development and Employment

7. to the Minister for Social Development and Employment: Does she have confidence the Government is doing all it can to make sure children in emergency housing are safe; if so, why?

We need to keep in mind that the emergency housing special needs grant was only introduced in 2016 by the then National Government in response to the number of New Zealanders who found themselves sleeping in cars or on the streets. At that point in time, there was no thought given to wraparound support services or the suitability of accommodation options. We have spent the last 3½ years working to improve the system we inherited. In recent months, that has meant taking a more localised approach, like in Rotorua, where we have begun a new way of working that will involve cohorting of families to improve wraparound support and safety. No Government can give absolute assurances that we can keep all New Zealanders safe in all places at all times. However, the Government will always do everything it can to improve safety for New Zealanders; that includes those in emergency housing.

💬 Hon Louise Upston: Why is the Government relying on gangs to self-declare their membership, rather than using the Gang Intelligence Centre information to prevent gangs being placed in the same motels as children?

💬 Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: I think that that member knows that gangs taking up emergency accommodation is not a huge issue in our regions, and so it seems that it’s just an attempt to demonise those that are in emergency accommodation. When people apply for emergency housing grants, they are asked whether or not they have gang affiliation. You cannot force people to tick “Yes” to that question. The Ministry of Social Development (MSD) and emergency housing is the last port of call for all New Zealanders when they find themselves homeless. At times, that is also gang members. So I do want to remind the House, though, that none of my regional commissioners have highlighted a massive increase or any type of increase in gang members seeking emergency accommodation.

💬 Hon Louise Upston: Point of order, Mr Speaker. Thank you, Mr Speaker. I was quite careful in specifically using the words “the Gang Intelligence Centre information”, and I don’t recall the Minister addressing that question that I asked, sir.

💬 SPEAKER: I think that’s fair. It was a very full response to a different question. I’ll get the member to ask the question again.

💬 Hon Louise Upston: Why is the Government relying on gangs to self-declare their membership, rather than using the Gang Intelligence Centre information to prevent gangs being placed in the same motels as children?

💬 Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: We have not had it raised by our regional commissioners out in the regions that gang access to emergency accommodation is a concern or that it’s heightened in any way. We have not sought out that information that the member is asking for. As I said, we have a self-declare system in place, and that is what we’re using at this moment.

💬 Hon Louise Upston: Do the regional commissioners talk to the local police officers on a regular basis?

💬 Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: Yes, they do, and it’s also important to note that where issues do arise in emergency accommodation—keeping in mind that they are seldom and far between and they are of course not always gang members—it is up to the police to then respond to those criminal matters. It’s not up to MSD to respond to that.

💬 Hon Louise Upston: How can she have confidence children are safe when a May police briefing said there are reports of—and I quote—“violence, intimidation, public urination, drug deals and gang involvement” at emergency housing that MSD is using?

💬 Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: There have been instances of all those things, but we can’t conflate them into just being with gang members. Family violence is an issue that we face inside emergency housing at some times and also in private households, so we can’t put this down to gang membership and gang members, necessarily, accessing emergency accommodation.

💬 Hon Louise Upston: How can this Government claim it’s improving children’s lives when over 4,300 children have been placed into motels, 3½ years after they came into Government, and they’re still not taking basic precautions like using gang intelligence information about keeping those children safe from harm?

💬 Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: We, as a Government, are taking far more precautions than what the previous National Government were taking when they set up the emergency special needs grant. As we have gone on, we have continued to improve the system. The response to Rotorua, which is highly localised, is in response to our coordination with social services, with council, with iwi on the ground. We are moving in that particular area to a cohorted model so that we can ensure that children in families are located in the same place, and, as the Prime Minister said earlier, that is a model that we are seeking to also roll out, keeping in mind there was no system in place when the National Government implemented this, no wraparound support systems in place, and no regard for whether or not the accommodation was appropriate or suitable.

Question No. 8—Oceans and Fisheries

8. to the Minister for Oceans and Fisheries: What announcements has the Government made regarding oceans and fisheries?

Last week, the Government announced a ministerial inquiry into the use and allocation of migrant labour in the seafood sector. The inquiry will focus on the sector’s reliance on migrant labour and how to transition it away from that reliance. We’ll also examine how to accelerate efforts to attract more New Zealanders into rewarding jobs in the seafood sector. It will consider commercial seafood activities, including deep-sea fishing, inshore fishing, aquaculture, and seafood processing. The COVID-19 border restrictions have highlighted the sector’s vulnerability due to its reliance on migrant labour. While businesses in the sector have worked to reduce that reliance, some deep-sea vessels in particular are still 100 percent foreign-crewed. This work will provide information needed to understand where improvements can be made so that the industry can be more resilient and more New Zealanders can have the opportunity to participate.

💬 Rachel Brooking: How is the Government integrating oceans and fisheries policies?

💬 Hon DAVID PARKER: The Prime Minister created this portfolio in 2020 to focus on ocean ecosystems as a whole. In response, we’ve begun a coordinated approach to address ocean sustainability issues through a raft of programmes and initiatives. Our vision is to ensure the long-term health and resilience of oceans and coastal ecosystems, including the role of fisheries. Our vision for the oceans, as I’ve said, includes the role of fisheries, commercial and otherwise. The jobs the industry provides are important to many communities, and high-quality products sent around the world earn valuable export dollars. We’ve got a cross-agency coordination group comprising officials from the Department of Conservation, the Ministry for Primary Industries, the Ministry for the Environment, and other agencies as appropriate.

💬 Rachel Brooking: What other announcements has the Government made regarding oceans and fisheries?

💬 Hon DAVID PARKER: There’s been a suite of initiatives in the last month. This has included our announcements on plans for the Hauraki Gulf. We’ve set out the funding and time line for the implementation of cameras on boats for the inshore fishing fleet, we’ve announced changes around rules around the dumping of fish at sea, we’ve set out how we’re going to modernise fisheries regulations, and we have laid out our initial response to the report of the Prime Minister’s Chief Science Advisor on commercial fishing. This has been done at a pretty fast pace, but there’s still quite a bit more to do, and I thank stakeholders and officials, including the industry, for their participation to date.

💬 Hon Eugenie Sage: How does the Minister propose to protect the sea-floor and seabed sediments in New Zealand waters as an important storehouse for carbon from the impacts of bottom trawling, which creates plumes of sediments and mobilises carbon?

💬 Hon DAVID PARKER: We’ve already laid out plans to restrict the areas of trawling within the Hauraki Gulf area to corridors that are yet to be specified but will be significantly reduced in area compared with current trawling efforts. In respect of bottom trawling in the deep sea, we’re not proposing to ban it. We will look at issues as to whether we should have restrictions on what I think is in the media today as virgin areas being bottom trawled and whether we should be holding bottom trawling to the areas that have previously been bottom trawled, and we’ll also work with the industry to improve technology so as to minimise damage. In terms of sediment issues, a lot of those are land-based, but I would agree with the member that they need to be addressed too.

💬 Rawiri Waititi: How does the Minister uphold mātaitai that have been signed off but challenged by the commercial fishers in that particular area?

💬 Hon DAVID PARKER: I take advice where applications are made for the establishment of mātaitai areas, and there are a number in New Zealand that have been successfully established and operate well. There are sometimes disagreements as to proposals for new ones, and where there are disagreements, I take advice from fisheries officials and run a fair process to work those issues through.

Question No. 9—Social Development and Employment

Before I call question No. 9, I just advise the House that I have been advised by the Minister that because its answer is somewhat technical, it is even longer than she normally gives.

9. to the Minister for Social Development and Employment: How many people, if any, receiving unabated main benefits will not see a net increase of $20 in their bank account weekly as a result of the July increase to main benefits?

The short answer is: all people on a main benefit receive a net increase of $20, and that was effective as of 1 July, keeping in mind, though, that benefits are paid in arrears and so it won’t be in full effect until next week when they get the full payment that they are entitled to. However, I believe the member is asking whether supplementary assistance such as accommodation supplement and temporary additional support will be affected by the $20 rise in benefits. The system we use to pay income support is complicated and we are undertaking a longer-term project to simplify it. Supplementary assistance is also available to working people; therefore, how much an individual is eligible for depends on how much they earn and what their costs are. If someone’s wages or benefit goes up, then their supplementary assistance will adjust depending on these costs. But when temporary additional support falls, it is not abated dollar for dollar for beneficiaries. The formula is more complicated.

From 1 July, those who received a benefit increase of $20 could find themselves better off per week by $26 when supplementary assistance adjusts. Others who have lower weekly costs may find themselves better off by around $15 per week. I am not able to give the exact figure the member asked for because the number of people on benefit changes daily and not everyone will have received their full increase yet, as benefits, as I said, are paid in arrears.

Also important to mention that the modelling originally used by the Ministry of Social Development (MSD) and Treasury during the Budget process modelled assuming 372,000 would be receiving a benefit as of 1 July, when the actual number is closer to 354,000. So it is complicated, but the reality is that the vast majority of people are going to be better off, and we look forward to 1 April next year, when the full increase kicks in.

Ricardo Menéndez March: How many people will not receive the full extra $20 a week in hand because they also get the accommodation supplement, temporary additional support, and another payment to meet the cost of living—and this is not just about those better off?

💬 Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: So the majority of people will be better off. There’s only 125 people out of the 354,000 that will not be better off, and they will get a temporary additional payment in place to ensure that they are no worse off. But what I have asked MSD to do and what they will be doing is, in the next few weeks, a point-in-time study to actually ascertain the brackets in terms of how much people are better off. But for the vast majority, it’s more than $15 a week, and, as I said, some will be better off by $26. In fact, I’ve been told some may be better off by $29 per week when the adjustments are actually made.

Ricardo Menéndez March: Will the top-up provided to people who would otherwise be worse off with benefit increases as a result of the complex interaction between benefits and supplementary assistance lift their benefits so they now receive a full additional $20 a week in hand?

💬 Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: My understanding is that it ensures that they don’t fall below what they’re currently getting, so that 125 people out of the 354,000 will not fall below, and my understanding is that once the increase kicks in on 1 April, then they will be better off.

Ricardo Menéndez March: Can the Minister confirm if there will be people who will not be receiving a net increase in their bank account of at least $20?

💬 Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: Everyone will get a net increase in their bank account of $20, but how it affects their supplementary support is different. But, as I said, the vast majority of people will be better off by at least $15 per week, and some even upwards of $26 per week.

💬 Debbie Ngarewa-Packer: Does she agree with Auckland Action Against Poverty co-ordinator Brooke Fiafia that the recent $20 benefit increase that some aren’t yet receiving is trash more than transformational?

💬 Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: No, I don’t. If it was just one $20 benefit increase that we were putting into place, then that would be insufficient, but we’ve had a programme of work in welfare reform that has been running since we started. We’ve seen the indexation of benefits to wages, which will see them go up more every year; we had a $25 increase last year; we’ve repealed one major sanction and are on the verge of repealing another major sanction; we have made changes to the culture and the way that MSD works with clients; we’ve lifted abatement thresholds so that people can earn more without losing the benefit, like they were before; and we’ve got more benefit increases coming into effect on 1 April. Those are only some of the changes. No one change is transformational, but the programme of work that we have had under way is transformational.

Question No. 10—COVID-19 Response

10. to the Minister for COVID-19 Response: What percentage of people living in residential care have not had at least one dose of the COVID-19 vaccine, and is he satisfied with the vaccine roll-out in New Zealand?

The number of people in residential care is not static, so a specific percentage is impossible to calculate with accuracy. However, I can confirm that of the 668 aged residential care facilities across the country, all but seven facilities have received at least their first dose of the vaccine. DHBs are working closely with the remaining seven facilities, who are scheduled to receive their first dose of the vaccine in the coming weeks. In regards to the second part of the member’s question, yes.

💬 Chris Bishop: Why has Canterbury, the country’s second-biggest region by population, only administered 7,310 doses to those in group 3, as per the numbers he’s released today, when down the road the South Canterbury DHB has delivered more?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: I can confirm that people who live in aged residential care facilities are, in fact, in group 2 rather than group 3, so in reference to the primary question, it is irrelevant.

💬 Chris Bishop: Point of order, Mr Speaker. That does not address the question at all, and it’s well within the scope because the second leg of the primary—“is he satisfied with the vaccine roll-out in New Zealand?”—I asked about group 3 in Canterbury and South Canterbury.

💬 SPEAKER: OK. It’s been long established in the House that if the member wants a specific answer, he should put down a specific question, and having a general throwaway “is he satisfied” is not enough to get the Minister to bring that level of detail to the House.

💬 Hon Gerry Brownlee: But it’s OK for him to go on TV and talk about it?

💬 SPEAKER: Thank you for your support, Mr Brownlee.

💬 Chris Bishop: Why has the Canterbury DHB only administered just over 7,000 doses to those in group 3 of the vaccine roll-out?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: It is fair to say that the size of the population in groups 1 and 2 is different in each DHB level, and that will have an impact on the number of doses they’ve delivered in group 3.

💬 Chris Bishop: Why are there still National Health Index number matching problems for the vaccination status of border workers, and how many are in the unvaccinated group that he said today the Government was still chasing down?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: My understanding is that as the team have looked through the individual records of people who are showing up in the border worker testing register as unvaccinated, they have found that some of those workers have been vaccinated but that the data isn’t matching correctly to pull through their vaccination register into the border worker testing register. They’re working to resolve that issue and, where possible, to manually match to ensure that the border worker testing register is as up to date as possible.

💬 Chris Bishop: So how many workers are there at the front line, working at the border, who have not been vaccinated?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: It sits somewhere around about 15 percent of the overall active workers on the border worker testing register.

Question No. 11—Transport

11. to the Minister of Transport: What progress has been made on replacing the Interislander ferries?

I’m pleased to confirm that we’re another step closer to replacing our ageing Interislander fleet. KiwiRail has now formally signed a contract with Korea’s Hyundai Mipo Dockyard to build two new Interislander ferries. The new ferries are expected to arrive in New Zealand in 2025 and 2026, and will help reduce transport emissions and support more goods and people crossing the Cook Strait.

💬 Rachel Boyack: What benefits will they have for our environment?

💬 Hon MICHAEL WOOD: Our transport emissions are the fastest-growing source of greenhouse gas emissions in New Zealand, so we need to start taking action now if we’re going to meet our 2050 targets. These new ferries will reduce the Interislander’s carbon emissions by 40 percent, with initiatives like using battery power for manoeuvring. They are also futureproofed so that more batteries can be added over time, and are to be modified to run on other low-carbon fuels like hydrogen as they become available in the future.

💬 Rachel Boyack: How will the new ferries cater for growth?

💬 Hon Member: They’ll be bigger.

💬 Hon MICHAEL WOOD: The Cook—Mr Goldsmith has been consulting a spreadsheet, and it’s right for once. The Cook Strait ferries are crucial to our economy, carrying 5.5 million tonnes of freight and 850,000 passengers between the North and South Islands every year. The new ferries nearly double passenger capacity and triple rail freight capacity of the current fleet, helping support the expected growth on this important route. Being able to accommodate rail wagons on the new ferries will encourage more freight on to trains and off roads, which will also help to reduce emissions and congestion on our busy roads.

Question No. 12—Housing (Public Housing)

12. to the Associate Minister of Housing (Public Housing): When, if ever, have there been more people on the public housing register waiting to be housed than there were in the official figures for March 2021, and by what date will she commit to a reduction in the number of people waiting to be housed?

The waiting list reflects the strong emphasis we have placed on people coming forward and telling us if they need housing support. As the member has said, our housing challenges have built up over successive Governments, and if you look back on the graph about when—[Interruption]

💬 SPEAKER: Order! Order! I’m just going to say I’d like the Leader of the Opposition, who’s been pretty loud today, just to wind it back as an example, especially to a couple of people not very far away from her—no, not Dr Reti—who are making quite a lot of noise today. I think this is an area which the Opposition would like to continue their questioning on.

💬 Hon POTO WILLIAMS: Thank you, Mr Speaker. As the member has said, our housing challenges have built up over successive Governments, and if you look back on the graph about when it all started going badly wrong, that was about 1991. The wait-list is the largest it’s been, which is why the Government has committed to the largest public housing build programme in decades, with over 18,000 additional public and transitional homes to be built and delivered by 2024. I will not be committing to a specific date for a reduction. Instead, I’m committed to our build programme, which, the member has acknowledged, gets it right.

💬 Nicola Willis: What responsibility, if any, does she take for the State house waiting list more than quadrupling since Labour came to office?

💬 Hon POTO WILLIAMS: What I do accept is that if the National Party in Government had built the numbers of houses that were required, we wouldn’t be in the state that we are in. If they had even just built 6,000 houses, our housing register waiting list would not be as high as it is. There’s no doubt that there is more to do, and that’s why we have committed to building 18,000 public and transitional houses. I’m very supportive of that programme, as is the member herself.

💬 Nicola Willis: Why has the number of people classified as having the highest possible housing risk leapt from three in December 2017 to 198 today, and does she think it’s acceptable that those at-risk people will now spend an average six months on the waiting list?

💬 Hon POTO WILLIAMS: It’s not acceptable that our people have to wait, and that’s why this Government is investing billions in the public housing programme. We’re on track to fund and deliver over 18,000 new public and transitional houses. If I could just refer to that member’s own comment that she herself would stick to the State housing build programme of this current Government.

💬 Nicola Willis: Can she confirm that most of the new public housing spaces her Government claims to have created are not new builds, but, instead, are existing homes that have been taken out of the private market for use as State housing—

💬 Hon Paul Goldsmith: Tell me it’s not true!

💬 Nicola Willis: —and how does that help solve New Zealand’s housing shortage?

💬 SPEAKER: The member had better apologise to his colleague pretty quickly.

💬 Hon POTO WILLIAMS: Mr Speaker—

💬 SPEAKER: No. Order! Mr Goldsmith’s going to stand, withdraw, and apologise.

💬 Hon Paul Goldsmith: I withdraw and apologise.

💬 Hon POTO WILLIAMS: I absolutely reject the premise of that member’s question.

💬 Hon Dr Megan Woods: Has the member heard any alternative plans from any other organisations about how to solve the issue of having more public houses in New Zealand, or is she going on the Opposition spokesperson’s comment on TV this week: “I’d stick to the State house building programme [of this current] Government”?

💬 Chris Bishop: Point of order, Mr Speaker. The Minister has no responsibility for Opposition spokespeople’s statements.

💬 SPEAKER: That’s true, but there’s a question of whether she was going to use an alternative to it or not.

💬 Hon POTO WILLIAMS: I have not heard of any alternatives. In fact, the only alternative I have heard is that that member has said that she would stick to the State house building programme currently in progress.

💬 Nicola Willis: Was she advised that the Government’s new housing tax policies could increase the number of people on the housing register and in emergency housing, and, if so, why is the Government pressing ahead with this change at a time of record State housing waiting lists?

💬 Hon POTO WILLIAMS: We were very clear in our housing policy that we preference first-home buyers, and there is no evidence to suggest that people are being disadvantaged in accessing the public housing waiting list as a result of that. I refute what the member says, and I would encourage the member to keep supporting the Government in its housing build programme.