Oral Questions

3. to the Minister of Finance: Does he stand by all of his statements and actions?

Yes, in the context in which they were made and undertaken.

💬 Hon Paul Goldsmith: Regarding his statement last week that “it is far from business as usual”, will his Budget reprioritise spending from nice-to-have projects to saving jobs?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: I am always focused on saving jobs, creating jobs, and creating decent work with good pay for all New Zealanders.

💬 Hon Paul Goldsmith: Does he stand by his statement on 25 March that measures including the $6.25 billion business finance guarantee scheme show that business and workers “we have your backs”?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: I think the full range of initiatives that the Government has brought in over the last six or seven weeks are doing exactly that. In terms of the business finance guarantee scheme, the member will be aware we’ve made some changes to that scheme, and I continue to consider what other changes we can make to ensure it operates well. I would also add that, since that scheme was put in place, we, of course, have also put in place the small business loan guarantee scheme.

💬 Hon Paul Goldsmith: Does he accept that the Government-backed loan scheme that he announced on 24 March has failed, given the scheme has only so far lent 0.37 percent of what it was supposed to have lent?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: I don’t think that at any point we thought it would be $6.25 billion in the first few weeks of operation, so I don’t accept that overall premise of the member’s question, but I do accept—as I’ve said publicly—that that scheme needed to be changed from its initial design. We’ve done that, and I continue to look at further possible changes.

💬 David Seymour: Did he ever think it would only be $27 million in the first few weeks of operation?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: I think we have to put that in the context of the overall amount of lending that banks have done in this period: around $5 billion worth of additional support that they have provided. As I said, the scheme has been tweaked. I’m considering further tweaks, and obviously—as of today, in fact—applications are open for the small business loan guarantee scheme which we announced subsequent to that scheme.

💬 David Seymour: What was the point of the scheme if banks were going to lend anyway, as the Minister just said?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: The point was to ensure that banks didn’t just lend to the customers that they were 100 percent comfortable with. We wanted to make sure that medium-sized businesses in particular had an avenue to go there, that’s why we guaranteed it at 80 percent of those loans. I’ve been very public about the fact that there have been some examples presented to me where I haven’t thought that the scheme was operating the way that it should. We’re continuing to work with banks on that. And I also would pick up the words of the Bankers’ Association about the point at which that particular scheme may become more useful as people are more certain now that we’ve moved into level 2.

💬 Hon Paul Goldsmith: Has any cash been given back to businesses under the Government’s loss carry-back scheme that was announced two weeks ago?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: I believe the Prime Minister addressed this matter in her press conference today, actually. I think somewhere in the region of $60-odd million has, and I expect that to grow considerably.

💬 Hon Paul Goldsmith: Can he assure New Zealanders that programmes funded by the Budget will deliver more than that $6 billion business finance guarantee scheme?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: I think the member needs to look at the full range of support that the Government has delivered, including the wage subsidy scheme which has delivered $10.7 billion. All of the suite of measures that we’ve announced are important and useful and, yes, the Budget will also contain ones that are important and useful.

Question No. 4—Finance

4. to the Minister of Finance: What announcements has the Government made with respect to Budget 2020?

While the vast bulk of the Budget remains for Budget day, as is the tradition of Governments of the past there have been some early announcements. Our plan to combat the global COVID-19 pandemic has three stages: respond, recover, and rebuild. I’ve announced that Budget 2020 will focus on laying the groundwork for the recover and rebuild stages. It will strengthen our public services and provide significant investments to get New Zealanders back to work and to begin tackling some of our long-term economic challenges. These are necessary investments, given the extremely difficult global and domestic economic outlook that is ahead of us. This will change our fiscal outlook substantially and, as I have said before, with higher debt and deficits for an extended period, I remain committed to managing our books carefully and responsibly. And, right now, being responsible means investing money to support our people, our businesses, and our communities to get through this and to rebuild.

💬 Kiritapu Allan: What announcements has he made regarding funding for health in Budget 2020?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: This morning I announced alongside the health Minister, Dr David Clark, that Budget 2020 will deliver the biggest ever increase in the funding of district health boards. The different abilities of Governments around the world to respond to the global COVID-19 pandemic has highlighted just how important it is to have well-funded public services like our health system. The $3.92 billion boost to DHBs is a 9 percent increase of funding following on from 5 percent and 4.5 percent increases in the previous years. It is added to by $282.5 million for a planned care catch-up programme. Budget 2020 will continue this Government’s record of tackling the legacy of underfunding and neglect of our health system.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: Will there be more money going to horse racing than Pharmac in this Budget?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: Absolutely not, but, since the member raises it, it is worth noting that the 15,000 people directly employed by the racing industry and the 60,000 people indirectly employed by the racing industry will be pleased to know that the Government values all jobs in New Zealand, not just the ones the member picks out.

💬 Kiritapu Allan: What other announcements has the Government made regarding funding for education in Budget 2020?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: On Monday, education Ministers Chris Hipkins and Tracey Martin announced Budget 2020 investment of $320.8 million in early learning support, higher quality early learning for every child. This includes a $151.1 million funding boost for the pay of up to 17,000 qualified teachers working in education and care services, $122 million to fund a 2.3 percent increase in subsidy rates for education and care services, and additional help to professionalise home-based early learning and support for playcentres. As we respond to the impacts of COVID-19 on our society and economy, we must have strong public services, including our early learning system, to protect and improve our collective wellbeing.

Question No. 5—Prime Minister

5. to the Prime Minister: Is her Government the most open and transparent Government New Zealand has ever had?

This Government has certainly worked hard to be open and transparent, and we have done, for instance, a number of things to improve transparency, like, for the first time, introducing a policy for the proactive release of ministerial diaries and Cabinet papers. We’ve responded to record numbers of Official Information Act requests (OIAs), with Government agencies completing responses to 19,829 OIAs just between July and December 2019, compared to 14,000 roughly in 2017 for the same period. We’ve responded to a record number of written question requests, answering 103,117 so far this term, compared to 41,000 last term. In addition, just through COVID-19, obviously, we’ve tried to make sure that daily we’ve been available. I’ve done, personally, over 30 press conferences. The Epidemic Response Committee was set up in the absence of Parliament to allow questioning and the Opposition to have a voice and apply accountability. We released 317 documents on Friday as part of a proactive release to provide COVID material. This is alongside reporting, like weekly reporting from Treasury on the fiscals, weekly reporting now on benefit numbers through COVID-19 as well.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: Did a leaked email from her office on Friday say that “I would like to sign off and see all written responses. Do not put Minister up for interviews on this.”, and, if so, is that working hard to be open and transparent?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: The member is quoting from an email from a member of my staff, so I feel I should just clarify that, when she quotes “I”, that wasn’t a reference to myself. I’m only saying that because, of course, it is not my expectation I receive those personal requests personally. We have received some feedback that the time of day of that release was an issue. We have given a commitment that we’ll look to provide that kind of information now in the mornings, and that we will signal in advance when that information is being provided to try and ease, for instance, the gallery’s coverage of what was a large amount of information that we did want to make sure that we provided for the purposes of transparency.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: Did the Prime Minister see the memo before it went out?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: No, I only saw the email in preparation for question time, anticipating that the member would ask me questions about it.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: So if all communications have to go through the Prime Minister, then why didn’t this memo?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: Obviously, it was a reference to coordinating responses to a large amount of information, which is not unlike what the member did when they were in Government also. But also, you’ll note that I was not the first person to speak on these documents. Actually, Dr Clark was, and Minister Shaw also commented on the proactive release.

💬 Rt Hon Winston Peters: Did the Prime Minister get any communication—because this is about communication—of thanks from Mr Bridges or Paula Bennett for insisting upon the 10 people at funerals rule so that the National Party MPs couldn’t meet and roll their leaders?

💬 SPEAKER: I think there’s just far too much irony in that question.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: If, as she says, it is about lining up communications, then why did the leaked memo say, “There’s no real need to defend. Because the public have confidence in what has been achieved … Instead, we can dismiss.”?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: That is not language that I would use. Again, to come back to the substance of the issue, what we’re debating here is, actually, the release of 317 documents, and if the member would like to ask me any questions about any of those documents, I’d be happy to oblige.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: Does she have confidence in the senior adviser that wrote the memo and does she stand by the statements that he quite clearly made in the memo that “There’s no real need to defend. Because the public have confidence in what has been achieved … Instead, we can dismiss.”?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: To answer that question: yes, I do have confidence in that member.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: Is her office’s belief that “we can dismiss” the reason officials are no longer allowed to provide an assessment of the regulatory impact of her Government’s legislation?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: Again, I refute the basis of that question.

💬 Hon Members: It’s true.

💬 Hon Grant Robertson: That’s just not correct at all.

💬 SPEAKER: Order! Order! Just be very careful about the use of that word.

💬 Hon Grant Robertson: With respect to the primary question, has the Prime Minister seen the letter from Dr Ashley Bloomfield, the Director-General of Health, dated 7 May 2020, to the Hon Simon Bridges which corrects the factual inaccuracies that Mr Bridges presented to Dr Bloomfield at the committee, and has she heard whether or not Dr Bloomfield has had an apology from Mr Bridges?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: I have heard reports of that exchange.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: Is there a regulatory impact statement for today’s COVID legislation, and why was that legislation, if we’re working with the most open and transparent Government, only given to the Opposition less than 24 hours ago when the Government has had weeks to work on it?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: That member has that legislation because we provided an exposure draft for the Opposition. Equally, we’re providing it to others who have an interest in this area because these are extraordinary times—[Interruption]

💬 SPEAKER: Order! Can the people just stop shouting the Prime Minister down—the two senior members of the Opposition.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: I’m not shouting her down, sir—I’m not shouting her down; I’ve got an opinion.

💬 SPEAKER: You were.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: It’s called a debating chamber.

💬 SPEAKER: Stand, withdraw, and apologise.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: I withdraw and apologise for arguing with you.

💬 SPEAKER: Stand, withdraw, and apologise without any reflection on the Chair.

💬 Hon Paula Bennett: I withdraw and apologise.

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: I am very happy to answer the member’s question, though. There is no expectation or assertion here from the Government to do anything other than try and be open around pieces of legislation that we’re having to work at great pace on. There is no politics in a pandemic response. But there is an issue around, of course, timing. As the member is well aware, there just hasn’t been the same time usually available for the full drafting of legislation and process that we would usually want. We’ve tried to mitigate that through, of course, the select committee process the member has been a part of, and through providing documents and advice to the Opposition as quickly as we’re able to.

💬 Hon Gerry Brownlee: Why, then, did Cabinet decide not to have a one-day select committee on the bill that’s being moved through urgency today as recommended to Cabinet?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: Ultimately, it is about trying to get input on the bill in a meaningful way. The determination was we would try and do that through an exposure draft, because an afternoon at the select committee may not have been able to provide that space for meaningful feedback, and we are still seeking to do that through alternative means. I think the point is that effort is being put in here to do what we can in the time we have available, but the member would do well to remember this is a pandemic and we are working very hard under the circumstances we have.

💬 Hon David Parker: Is the Prime Minister also aware that the reason why that one-day select committee didn’t proceed was that that would’ve left a one-day gap between the earlier stage 2 start, which we’ve managed to bring forward by a day but which would’ve left an enforcement gap had the bill not been passed.

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: That, equally, was a factor. But, actually, also members did discuss that we did want input from those who had significant interest and expertise in these legal matters, and we felt by directly providing an exposure draft that would give us the ability to try and do that as well.

💬 Hon Chris Hipkins: Has the Prime Minister been advised that, following the Christchurch earthquakes, Parliament passed legislation without regulatory impact analysis that also had an impact on people’s human rights and their property rights?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: Yes, and I know the member who has asked the question knows how difficult it is to balance speed but whilst also allowing due process, and we have tried to do our best.

Question No. 6—Environment

6. to the Minister for the Environment: What confidence does he have that there will be sufficient support in Parliament to pass all stages of his bill to allow fast-tracking of consents for certain projects?

It’s not for me to prejudge the determination of parties in this House. We do, though, have the support of governing parties to first reading and further consideration of the bill following the select committee process.

💬 Hon Judith Collins: Does he believe that the process of introducing this bill meets the goal of being the most open and transparent Government ever?

💬 Hon DAVID PARKER: Yes, in the circumstances. I would note that the select committee period, which is yet to be determined, may be up to 12 days long, which, in fact, is 300 percent times the Kaikōura earthquake select committee process, which was just four days.

💬 Hon Judith Collins: Does he realise that the Kaikōura process that he’s just referred to referred to one project and not to multiple projects over the entire country?

💬 Hon DAVID PARKER: Yes.

💬 Hon Judith Collins: Is it correct to say that this bill that he would like passed next month has not yet been drafted?

💬 Hon DAVID PARKER: The drafting has not been finished, but it has been started.

💬 Hon Judith Collins: What are the criteria that he will use in deciding which projects would be fast-tracked?

💬 Hon DAVID PARKER: The primary criteria will be employment.

💬 Rt Hon Winston Peters: Could I ask the Minister, would that be an essential for the Government now if the previous nine years of the previous Government had have done anything whatsoever with the Resource Management Act (RMA)?

💬 Hon DAVID PARKER: If the RMA had been earlier reformed, it may not well be. In truth, the underlying RMA takes too long, costs too much—

💬 Hon Member: You never voted for it.

💬 Rt Hon Winston Peters: You had the majority.

💬 Hon DAVID PARKER: —and has not protected the environment.

💬 SPEAKER: Order! Would the pair of senior members just let the Minister answer. Former Minister.

💬 Hon DAVID PARKER: In truth, the underlying RMA takes too long, costs too much, and hasn’t protected the environment, and that’s why we’ve got that root-and-branch review of the RMA going on at the moment. I’m expecting a report back from that panel led by retired Justice Randerson QC before the election.

💬 Rt Hon Winston Peters: Does the Minister expect that the governmental parties will pass this legislation and are not going to throw the responsibility on other parties in the Parliament like the previous one did, who blamed members of the Opposition, when they had a majority, for not passing their own legislation?

💬 Hon DAVID PARKER: I’m confident that we will pass this legislation.

Question No. 7—Education

7. to the Minister of Education: What is the Government doing to address low pay and funding disparities in early childhood education?

Good news: as we respond to the impact of COVID-19 on our society and our economy, the Government remains committed to fair pay for lower-paid workers, especially the workers who have helped to get the country moving again. Yesterday, as part of Budget 2020, I announced that $151.1 million over the next four years will help to improve the pay of up to 17,000 qualified teachers working in education and care services. A significant pay gap has built up over time between these teachers and those working in schools and kindergartens, following a decision 10 years ago to stop passing on to education and care services the funding rate increases that kindergartens got to meet the cost of pay settlements. Now, from 1 July, the minimum salary for teachers working in education and care services will increase to $49,862, bringing it into line with kindergarten teachers’ pay. We’ve got a way to go, but this is a very good start.

💬 Kieran McAnulty: What response has he seen to this announcement?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: Teachers have welcomed the announcement. The NZEI, speaking on behalf of early childhood teachers, has described it as “fantastic news”. They’ve called it a significant first step towards pay parity for early childhood education teachers, and a clear sign that the Government is hearing the call to further invest in early childhood education.

💬 Kieran McAnulty: How else is Budget 2020 addressing funding disparities in early childhood education?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: I’m very pleased to say that yesterday, in conjunction with my Associate Minister Tracey Martin, we also announced that there’ll be an extra $3.1 million invested in our Playcentre movement. This will help to increase funding rates for Playcentre from July, supporting more than 400 playcentres up and down the country so that they can continue to provide what is a unique early learning choice for 9,500 children and their families. That means that Playcentre rates will increase by 7.6 percent, the largest increase they have received in a very long time. We consider that the ongoing sustainability of playcentres would be compromised without this additional funding, and we look forward to working with Playcentre to ensure their long-term sustainability.

Question No. 8—Tourism

8. to the Minister of Tourism: Does he know what proportion of tourism and hospitality businesses will be profitable under alert level 2 restrictions without additional Government financial support?

Many tourism and hospitality businesses will be able to operate under alert level 2. The Government’s economic package, which includes wage subsidies and tax provisions, is ongoing during this time, and I’ll be announcing on Thursday additional support and assistance, including a tourism recovery package on Budget day.

💬 Hon Todd McClay: What does he say to those businesses that told the Epidemic Response Committee today that a large number of tourism, accommodation, and hospitality businesses are likely to fail under level 2 restrictions, even with further support?

💬 Hon KELVIN DAVIS: Under levels 3 and 4, there was absolutely no tourism and no movement around the country, and, under level 2, it’s the beginning of the recovery. The businesses have all been able to make use of the business support package that the Government has offered them, and, as I said, there is a tourism package being announced on Thursday.

💬 Hon Todd McClay: Is the event sector able to organise business meetings of up to 100 people under level 2 from Thursday if they meet the same social distance requirements as cinemas, restaurants, or political party caucuses?

💬 Hon KELVIN DAVIS: Events are an important part of the tourism sector and drive regional tourism. Officials continue to work with them on what level 2 means for them, and we expect a plan for the event sector early next week.

💬 Hon Todd McClay: Why are Government agencies cancelling meetings and events for the end of this year, as heard in the pandemic committee today, rather than providing support and confidence to the hospitality, event, and travel sectors?

💬 Hon KELVIN DAVIS: As I said in the select committee today, Government agencies are just like any other business. If they can operate in line with the guidelines, well, then they will do so.

💬 Hon Todd McClay: So is the Minister saying that Government agencies can’t operate within the guidelines and that’s the reason that they are cancelling events and meetings at the end of this year and not showing support or giving confidence to the hospitality, travel, or accommodation sectors?

💬 Hon KELVIN DAVIS: Government agencies are no different to anyone else. We need to obey the guidelines and follow the guidelines in order to make sure that we don’t spread COVID-19. The last thing we need is a spike because people haven’t followed the guidelines, and then we end up reverting back up the levels, which is no good for anyone—for the economy at all or any tourism business.

💬 Hon Todd McClay: So if Government agencies cannot organise meetings by following the restrictions and guidelines provided by his Government, how can a single other tourism, hospitality, or accommodation business in New Zealand plan to do the same thing today, if the Government can’t follow their own advice?

💬 Hon KELVIN DAVIS: The member needs to get his ears cleaned because that’s not what I said. What I did say was that the Government agencies must follow the same guidelines as everybody else.

Question No. 9—Health

9. to the Minister of Health: Does he stand by the restrictions for alert level 2?

Yes. In particular, I stand by the decision to use a staged approach to the resumption of some activities such as the reopening of bars, which we know from the experience of South Korea can pose a particular transmission risk.

💬 Hon Louise Upston: What is the public health evidence that supports a limit on funerals to 10 people over the original 100 people?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: The advice I have received relates to the number of people at a gathering and the risks that pertain thereto. I have to say that in respect of funerals and tangi, this was one of the most difficult decisions that we had to take as a Cabinet. I personally found it very challenging to work through, but we didn’t want to see a double jeopardy, which has been seen overseas at funerals, where people come together to grieve and then the virus is transmitted, leading to further tragedy.

💬 Hon Louise Upston: Does he agree with the president of the Funeral Directors Association that restrictions on funerals are “a cruel and heartless blow to the thousands of New Zealand families who have lost loved ones and is unjustifiable.”?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: Funerals are a time when people, naturally, need physical comfort from each other. The decision to restrict that was not one we took lightly. I do disagree with those comments as they’ve been presented by the member.

💬 Hon Louise Upston: What does he say to the family who delayed a funeral under alert level 3 because the guidance for alert level 2 announced by the Prime Minister last Thursday included gatherings up to 100 people, only to be told yesterday that the restriction is now only 10?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: I do reject the premise of the question, and I do, again, want to acknowledge that this is a particularly difficult issue for people. As I’ve said, I know that I found this a difficult decision—to restrict the attendance at funerals—and I know the Prime Minister did and other members of the Cabinet also. But we do not want to see community transmission, and we do not want to see the kind of tragedy that’s happened overseas at funerals where people have come together to mourn a loved one and then further tragedy has ensued. We hope that in a short period of time, we will continue to see the risk diminished, and then we will see the ability for more people to gather. But when people gather and are in funeral situations—having conducted them myself, I know that people want to physically console each other, and it does not seem fair to put people in a position where there is risk to them and to the wider community.

💬 Hon Louise Upston: What does he say to the man whose wife, sadly, passed away from cancer, who has to explain to his young daughter that under level 2, a rugby team of 15 can have physical contact and play a game, but that she can’t have all the support she needs when she says her final goodbye to her mum?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: Naturally, I feel very sad for that family. This is the kind of situation that is not an easy one at any time—when grieving their loved ones. In terms of the specific matters the member raises, I would observe that professional sport only at this stage is progressing, and that is with strict contact tracing in place. But, equally, I’d go back to the main point that I’ve made before that tangi and funeral are places where people come together to grieve and physically support each other—physically support each other. This is a difficult thing, and I, as I say, am hopeful that in time we will be able to ease these restrictions.

💬 Rt Hon Winston Peters: Was the Minister encouraged by listening to a Polynesian undertaker on Morning Report this morning, who set out that he fully understood the Government’s position and how difficult in the Pasifika and Māori setting it was to keep people apart in that most difficult emotional moment—

💬 Hon Judith Collins: Does this undertaker have a name?

💬 Rt Hon Winston Peters: —at a tangi or a funeral, and he backed the Government in the full—

💬 Hon Judith Collins: Or is it enough to refer to him by his race?

💬 SPEAKER: Order! Judith Collins has just lost two supplementaries for her side.

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: Sorry, Mr Speaker, I missed the last part of the member’s question.

💬 SPEAKER: Well, I’m going to ask the question to be asked again.

💬 Rt Hon Winston Peters: Was he encouraged by the Polynesian undertaker on Morning Report this morning, who understood—

💬 Hon Judith Collins: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker.

💬 SPEAKER: The member can’t interrupt a question unless it relates to this question.

💬 Hon Judith Collins: Mr Speaker, perhaps if you listened to me, I find it deeply offensive—

💬 SPEAKER: Order! The member will resume her seat. Winston Peters, complete the supplementary. Start your supplementary again, please.

💬 Rt Hon Winston Peters: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. That member just made a comment about “his race”. What did she mean by that?

💬 Hon Gerry Brownlee: How can he take a point of order and she can’t?

💬 Hon Judith Collins: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker.

💬 SPEAKER: Speaking to the point of order of the Rt Hon Winston Peters.

💬 Hon Judith Collins: Thank you.

💬 SPEAKER: And just to make it absolutely clear, one may not interrupt a supplementary question for a point of order unless it relates exactly to that point of order. Once interrupted, however rudely, a further point of order can be taken. Speaking to this point of order, the Hon Judith Collins.

💬 Hon Judith Collins: Mr Peters has asked a question. My concern is that he has referred to the undertaker by that man’s race as though that is actually relevant. Either he has a name, this undertaker, or he is an undertaker. Why is it necessary to bring the man’s race into the issue?

💬 Rt Hon Winston Peters: I can answer that question. I referred to his race because he clearly understood the Pasifika or Māori tangi setting. That’s the only reason why I referred to him—not to be ethnic or racial about it. But he just might understand more than some what the setting was all about.

💬 SPEAKER: Now, I just want to check that the Minister got the gist of the question—

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: I think I’ve got the gist of the question.

💬 SPEAKER: —probably—from what went back and forth.

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: I have had representations from members of the Pasifika and Māori community saying that they understood the reasons for having this separation, and, indeed, it is very difficult to maintain physical separation in those funeral settings because of the desire to physically comfort one another and because of certain cultural practices.

💬 SPEAKER: Question No. 11, Simon O’Connor.

💬 Simon O’Connor: If I might, actually, I think Paul Eagle was next—

💬 SPEAKER: Sorry?

💬 Simon O’Connor: —if you don’t mind.

💬 SPEAKER: Oh, sorry.

💬 Simon O’Connor: If you’d give us two supps back. Otherwise, I’ll take the call.

💬 SPEAKER: Did the member say he wants two supps taken away?

💬 Simon O’Connor: I’m not sure my hearing’s so good.

💬 SPEAKER: Well, the member had better sit down.

Question No. 10—Trade and Export Growth

10. to the Minister for Trade and Export Growth: What role does international trade have as part of the Government’s response to COVID-19?

Our immediate trade response to this crisis has been to keep trade flowing, with supply chains moving in and out, and to push back against protectionism. Together with my Singaporean colleague, I led a process that now involves 11 trade Ministers, including G7 economies Canada, Australia, and others, to push back internationally against rising protectionism. That has evolved into a bespoke supply line arrangement with Singapore and New Zealand. It’s also led to other initiatives, including a New Zealand - Singapore declaration which eliminated tariffs on goods essential for fighting the pandemic. This practical action is, we think, stimulating some of the other measures abroad: an initiative with Australia, Canada, Singapore, and Korea, where we’re working together on similar things—and the eventual movement of essential persons is another example.

💬 Paul Eagle: What are the next steps of the trade response to COVID-19?

💬 Hon DAVID PARKER: With the measures I’ve already described behind us, we can now focus on the medium-term response, which we are terming the three Rs: retooling exporter support by scaling up economic diplomacy, with offerings including the trade barrier portal, exporter helpline, our tariff finder website, and expanding market intelligence; we’re refreshing our existing trade architecture, not just for the World Trade Organization but the China upgrade and the digital economic partnership, which we position as signature-ready projects, and, of course, we’re looking to launch the free-trade agreement negotiations with the UK; and the third of the three Rs is reinvigorating and refocusing our trade relationships as we turn volume to value and seek to diversify our exports and markets.

💬 Paul Eagle: How will Budget 2020 support exporters?

💬 Hon DAVID PARKER: The Minister of Finance will announce the details of the Budget on Thursday, but I can say today that it’s critically important that we reconnect our exporters with overseas markets. It’s difficult for them to travel at the moment, obviously, so we need more boots on the ground as our overseas markets recover from COVID-19, because exports are critically important for New Zealand and our economy, and so our Government will provide support for our exporters.

Question No. 11—Health

11. to the Minister of Health: Does he stand by the restrictions for alert level 2?

Yes. In particular, I stand by the balance those restrictions strike between reopening our economy and continuing to keep people safe by, for example, continuing to use physical distancing and limiting the size of gatherings such as funerals and church services.

💬 Simon O’Connor: Why has the Government singled out temples, mosques, synagogues, and churches for discriminatory treatment by, effectively, banning their gatherings?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: I reject the premise of the member’s question, but what I would say is that, in accordance with a cautious approach that seeks to manage the public health risks, the limit on gatherings is initially no more than 10. I understand that will limit traditional church services, which do have close interaction between people. In fact, that is one of the main reasons for them to be held—the fellowship that they have in those worship settings. The intent is to increase the limit over time as we become more confident that that loosening of controls is not leading to an increase in infection. The member will be unsurprised to learn I do not wish to limit church services or other religious services any more than is necessary to protect public health.

💬 Simon O’Connor: Are freedom of association and freedom of religion—as described by the New Zealand Bill of Rights Act—still relevant in New Zealand today, or are they just a nice to have?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: They are still relevant.

💬 Hon Tracey Martin: Did the Minister hear a minister of the cloth this morning on the radio saying how they’ve been running their church services online, and that while they understood that only 10 people could gather, they would continue to run their church services online, and, actually, they’d had more people come to their online congregation than they had in the in-person congregations, and they would continue to run online services post-COVID restrictions because of that uptick?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: I did not hear that particular interview; however, I can confirm that the parish that I normally attend has been offering services online in just that fashion.

💬 Hon Chris Hipkins: Can the Minister confirm that the restrictions placed on New Zealanders under alert level 2 are far more liberal than many other countries we would compare ourselves to, including Australia?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: I can confirm that. We are in the fortunate position of having gone hard and having gone early, and having had a public willing to make sacrifices to ensure the success of that approach. When we look overseas to countries like the UK or like Italy or Spain—other countries around the world—they are facing lockdowns and many more restrictions for a time to come, and not only the economic consequences of that but also the social sacrifices they’re going to have to continue to make, all the while facing challenges with people dying from COVID-19

Question No. 12—Health

12. to the Minister of Health: What recent announcements has he made about what Budget 2020 will mean for district health boards and the services they provide?

This morning, the Minister of Finance and I announced a record investment in hospitals and health services. We announced that Budget 2020 will deliver the biggest ever increase in funding for district health boards, as well as additional funding to deliver approximately 153,000 surgeries and procedures, radiology scans, and specialist appointments to help clear the COVID-19 backlog.

💬 Kieran McAnulty: Why has the Government prioritised this spending in Budget 2020?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: A good question. Historically, successive Governments have under-invested in health. One of the key lessons of COVID-19 is the need for a strong and sustainable public health and disability system. Budget 2020 continues this Government’s record of tackling a legacy of neglect. Around the world, COVID-19 has wrought devastation on underprepared health systems. It is absolutely critical that as a country we continue to invest in and build up the capacity of our health system. That is what the Government is committed to doing.

💬 Kieran McAnulty: What types of procedures will be funded by this new money?

💬 Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: The record investment in DHBs of an extra $3.92 billion over four years will help improve their financial sustainability and clinical delivery. It will also enable them to meet the costs of a growing and ageing population and already agreed wage increases. Ministers have also approved $282.5 million, including $50 million of capital, to deliver an estimated 153,000 planned care procedures such as elective surgery, radiology scans, assessments and follow-ups, and procedures completed in outpatient facilities. Although critical and urgent care continued even under alert level 4, we know that many procedures were delayed. Our hospitals are now returning to a more normal level of service, but it will take time to recover and deal with the backlog.