Ngāti Awa Claims Settlement Bill

I raise a point of order, Mr Chairperson. You will recall that the last time the Committee was to consider this particular bill, I raised the issue of getting a translation of the Minister’s own Supplementary Order Paper tabled yesterday, which is to include a new recital (10A) in the Māori text of the preamble to the bill. The Minister in the chair on that evening said that a paper would be made available today to indicate exactly how all of this works. No such paper has been forthcoming.

💬 Hon Mark Burton: Oh yes it has.

It has certainly not been sent to my office, which would seem to be a major oversight on the part of the Minister. Rather, instead, we have on the Table of the House a proposed amendment to the Supplementary Order Paper, also in the name of the Hon Margaret Wilson, which asks the Committee to consider inserting in the proposed new recital (10A) in her Supplementary Order Paper, after the word “Hurae”, the expression “2002”. Now that leaves the Committee no clearer at all about what the situation is. I think it is quite disrespectful of the Minister to expect us to continue at the present time, and I move that the Committee defer this bill until the matter is cleared up.

💬 Hon Mark Burton: I gave an undertaking, and I regret that the member, for whatever reason, has not located the document. It was circulated, both electronically, and manually in hard copy, to every member’s office close to midday today. I gave an undertaking, and I honoured it. I have a hard copy of the paper, which the member is welcome to. I do regret that he has not located it for whatever reason, but I had it sent both by messenger and electronically. To the best of my knowledge every member should have received it, and I see at least one of the member’s colleagues nodding that she has received it. So I cannot explain why the member has not got it, but I certainly did circulate the document that I am holding in my hand.

I probably have not received that for the same reason that I did not receive an invitation to the Labour Party fest, known as the Hui Taumata, to take place the week after next. It seems to be a particular style of the current Minister in charge of Treaty Negotiations; perhaps that is at play. None the less, I do not think the matter is at all clear. I think perhaps the Minister should take a few minutes before we begin the debate to explain what is in his document. Because although members may well have been circulated, quite clearly one member was left off the circulation list.

The CHAIRPERSON (Hon Clem Simich): I thank Mr Brownlee. I undertook last night to have the matter looked into and some action taken. The Minister has done that. The member is welcome to a copy of the letter that was circulated—I see there is one there for him. The Minister is very happy to give any explanations that may be needed as we get into the debate. I do not propose to take the matter any further. I think it has been handled well. We are now on the Ngāti Awa Claims Settlement Bill, and the question is—

I raise a point of order, Mr Chairperson.

The CHAIRPERSON (Hon Clem Simich): The previous matter was not a point of order.

I am not going back over that. My point of order relates to the proposed amendments by way of a Supplementary Order Paper in the name of Pita Paraone. These are interesting proposals, and I think quite serious ones. For those who are unaware of the serious nature of this, essentially if this bill were to pass in its current form, then the House would, for the second time this session, be in a position of creating either new hapū or iwi by statute, something that is quite new and inappropriate. I therefore seek leave to move a motion for this bill to be sent back to the select committee in order that this particular matter might be better considered.

The matters raised by Mr Brownlee could have been dealt with when we moved through the debate on the bill. They relate to Part 2. The Committee has no power to grant leave to refer anything back to a select committee. That is a matter for the House. So we will proceed with the bill.

I raise a point of order, Mr Chairperson. This is a proper point of order—I am asking for your advice here. If we were to recall the Speaker, I assume that the House would then be in session and such leave could be sought and granted.

The CHAIRPERSON (Hon Clem Simich): That is correct. If the member does that, then that matter could be put to the House and dealt with by the Speaker.

Could I speak to that point of order before the member does that, because I may be able to help. Far from this bill creating hapū, I think when we get the opportunity to have a sensible debate on what I think is a genuinely intended, but I would suggest an erroneous, Supplementary Order Paper from the member, that will be a matter for fair debate. But far from it being the case that this bill creates the hapū, they actually exist in the Te Runanga o Ngati Awa Act. It is my understanding that they exist already in that Act.

The Minister referred to an earlier regulation, and I think that perhaps he may have been misadvised. Because that earlier regulation in no way refers to the word “hapū”. It refers to divisions or specific sections. But it does not refer to the word “hapū”.

The CHAIRPERSON (Hon Clem Simich): These are debatable matters, which we could have reached when we went through the bill, and very likely all members could have been satisfied. But I am in members’ hands.

I think this is a more serious matter than perhaps your understanding of it.

The CHAIRPERSON (Hon Clem Simich): All matters are serious in this Chamber, and this one probably more so than most.

Yes it is.

The CHAIRPERSON (Hon Clem Simich): That is why I am hearing from the member with a view to trying to accommodate the member’s wishes.

I want to give some explanation because I do not want to sound trite in this. But you could perhaps appreciate the situation where this bill has had a haphazard approach to it from the Minister. The Māori Affairs Committee was given a very short time to consider an extensive Supplementary Order Paper that was put on the table last year, early in October. As you know, the House concluded its business in December. That Supplementary Order Paper has found its way into this bill. There was quite a bit of pressure in the select committee process to get it there. The desire of the Committee, I am sure, is that all parties would want to support a settlement bill. But matters like this are not inconsiderable. It is about the mandating opportunities that the iwi concerned has. And I have already expressed some severe reservations about that process. But here we have, as Mr Pita Paraone has just made clear, a bill that creates a new, if one likes, designation for a group within the Ngāti Awa group—a hapū, which is a much bigger status than a group that has the affiliations that Mr Paraone just spoke of. I do want to see this taken through and the House given the opportunity to send it back to the select committee for, perhaps, another week’s work. Accordingly, I move that the Speaker be recalled.

I am afraid that I cannot resolve the matter for the member. We have commenced the Committee stage of the Ngāti Awa Claims Settlement Bill. If the member wishes to pursue the matter of whether the bill should be withdrawn or referred back to a select committee, then that is a matter for the Speaker. If the member wants that process to commence, it is over to him.

I move, That the Speaker be recalled.

I take it that the member has moved that the Committee reports progress?

💬 GERRY BROWNLEE: If that is the correct procedure, I am indeed moving to report progress.

💬 Hon Mark Burton: The member moved that we recall the Speaker.

💬 GERRY BROWNLEE: Yes, I have. Reporting progress is something a Government does when it wants to suspend a bill. If we report progress we will not be able to get to the bill again today. I just want to recall the Speaker.

Motion agreed to.

House resumed.

Speaker Recalled