Foreshore and Seabed Bill

The staff of the Fisheries and Other Sea-related Legislation Committee deserve the thanks of the whole House for the work they did over and above the call of duty. Their attitude to the committee was tremendous.

I stand to support the second reading of the bill. In doing so, I want first to acknowledge the contributions of the Government members, supported by the New Zealand First members, to the processes of the Fisheries and Other Sea-related Legislation Committee. I acknowledge Russell Fairbrother for his strong chairmanship, and also the contributions of my colleagues Dover Samuels, Mahara Okeroa, and Dail Jones, who played a significant part throughout the whole process—unlike some, who were there only during the hearings process. I have to say that that was more a case of political point-scoring than a genuine attempt to resolve many of the issues expressed by the submitters. The United Future member Larry Baldock often attended.

The bill as amended acknowledges the unique relationship Māori have with the coastline. Our tipuna signed the Treaty of Waitangi to seek Crown protection. I am satisfied that the provisions contained within the bill honour their legacy. However, there was an unrealistic expectation that the Government Māori caucus would deliver the entire foreshore and seabed to Māori ownership in fee simple title. That was never going to be the case. It was an expectation that required much more than we were able to provide. Some parties in this House have given Māori the impression that they are able to deliver that ownership.

Māori caucus members have advocated strongly throughout the entire process for the recognition of Māori customary interests and the right of Māori to have their day in court. As a result of the proposed changes to the bill, the High Court may grant a territorial customary rights order to Māori groups, which may result in the establishment of a foreshore and seabed reserve. For those who seek reserve status, the High Court will be able to direct them to the Crown to discuss redress options.

We believe that the proposed amendments will recognise some of the fundamental issues that were raised during the select committee process. No fee simple titles will be awarded, and this reflects the views of the majority of Māori who appeared before the select committee. We have been instrumental in strengthening the redress provisions around territorial customary rights. We recognise that this bill will not please the extremists or the purists. However, we are confident that it caters to the wishes of the majority of Māori, who take a more pragmatic view of progressing our development as a people. The Resource Management Act is currently being reviewed and will be strengthened to recognise more effective consultation with local Māori over coastal areas. We believe that this will provide stronger recognition of the traditional association of whānau, hapū, and iwi with the coast than the ancestral connection orders initially provided for in the legislation.

During the select committee process many submitters sought a longer conversation on the foreshore and seabed issue. However, we believe that would have stymied the aquaculture developments that many coastal iwi around the country are exploring. We Māori are very good at long conversations. The last one we had took 13 years. As Māori members representing a wide, diverse range of views, we could not allow this to happen. I heard in the House last night a speech advocating that we have a longer conversation. I wonder whether the many who came on the hīkoi who were involved in aquaculture development would have agreed with that speaker on that particular point. I doubt it very much. In fact, I have received many calls expressing great concern about that suggestion.

Māori caucus members have played an active role in the discussion on aquaculture and the setting aside of 20 percent of all marine farming space for Māori interests. Therefore, we believe that it is important that this opportunity not languish for another decade in much the same way as the Treaty of Waitangi fishing allocation process did. The consequence of a long conversation would have been a halt to aquaculture farming for years or even decades.

In the very little time I have left, I want to acknowledge much of the progress this Government has made in relation to Māori employment, or unemployment. The first thing many Māori families think about when they wake up each day is their children and their mokopuna. It is interesting that the latest figures on unemployment among Māori are below 8 percent. Never in the 18 years since the records have been kept has this been the case. There are 40,000 more Māori in work now than there were when this Government took office. In the mid-1990s, one in three Māori did not have a job. Now, under this Government, fewer than one in 10 are unemployed.

When I woke up this morning I turned on the radio and heard claptrap and rhetoric. That is what I heard this morning on Morning Report from a party that says it represents Māori, and then I heard a representative from the Green Party in and out of hallucination. She said that the members of this House did not have the courage—

Metiria Turei: I raise a point of order, Madam Speaker. It was difficult to hear the speaker. I am uncertain as to whether he referred to the Green Party member as “hallucinating”. If he did, I take personal offence at that comment and ask that it be withdrawn and apologised for.

Madam DEPUTY SPEAKER: Yes, I think that that is inappropriate. The member has taken offence. Would the Hon Dover Samuels please stand, withdraw, and apologise.

Hon DOVER SAMUELS: I withdraw and apologise. I was just saying that the person who made those comments on Morning Report this morning was, in my view, hallucinating—was somewhat under the influence. [Interruption] I did not refer to the Green Party.

Madam DEPUTY SPEAKER: The member has been called on the point of order. The Green Party member has taken offence. The member should not refer to that and insinuate the same point he made before. The member will withdraw and apologise.

Hon DOVER SAMUELS: I withdraw and apologise.

Hon Ken Shirley: I raise a point of order, Madam Speaker. I just want to get this clear. Are you telling us that now, as part of the record, we cannot use the word “hallucinating”—that we cannot say that another member is “dreaming” or “hallucinating”? Is this a new standard that you, from the Chair, are saying is unacceptable in the House?

Madam DEPUTY SPEAKER: No. The remark was a personal reflection on a member who took offence.

Hon DOVER SAMUELS: I support the second reading of the bill, and I tell the House that I have a vested interest. It may very well be that I have a conflict of interest. Why? Because I am a Māori and I belong to a hapū. In the generations of my people, my tūpuna at Matauri Bay, Ngāti Kura, there was never any recognition of any right given to their takutai moana—never in generations. I have never seen representation by any other party acknowledging that Māori have customary rights that have to be accorded and given effect to in the law. I have lived there for many years and my tūpuna are there. I challenge the other Māori members of the House to show me anywhere in legislation that Māori customary rights have ever been given effect to.

Those Green Party members who walked in and out of the select committee—who spent 5 minutes there—advocate on behalf of Māoridom and know nothing at all about customary rights. They know nothing about the relationship that Māori have with their takutai moana.

I ask the members of this House to show me any legislation passed in the history of this House, going back to the whakapapa or to 1840, where a Government and a party stood tall to recognise that Māori have customary rights to their takutai moana. This is the first time in the history of this nation—

Gerry Brownlee: 1996.

Hon DOVER SAMUELS: It does not matter about the balderdash from that member across the other side of House, who most of the time has his cellphone to his ear while talking to Don Brash and trying to justify his own existence instead of getting on with the business.

I am proud of this Government and I am proud that this Parliament has finally moved to give recognition that whānau and hapū have customary rights over their foreshore and seabed. I say to the member opposite that this legislation finally gives me the opportunity as a member of the hapū to take my case to the Māori Land Court and to the High Court. Never before in the history of this nation have those processes been available to our people—never before.

Along with my hapū I live by the sea. Some people would say that I have gills—not unlike my whanaunga there from Ngāti Wai, who lives by the sea also. I say to this House—and I think it is an important issue—that our customary rights have never been recognised in law—never!

Gerry Brownlee: Of course, they have.

Hon DOVER SAMUELS: I ask that member: where?

Hon Member: The Fisheries Bill.

Hon DOVER SAMUELS: We are talking about the foreshore and seabed. That is how those members are so far out and away from reality.

Never before have our rights been recognised in any legislation. I will ask the other party—the “Harawira Party”—to show me where they have been. I will ask the Green Party to show me if Māori customary rights have ever been recognised in legislation. My hapū, my ancestors, and my elders in generations right back—generations—have never had their customary rights recognised in the law of this land. Halleluiah to David; God bless; tihei mauri ora!

It is no matter about the old humbug and claptrap from the members of other parties—the intellectuals, the know-alls—who have never lived beside the sea and who would not know what the hell the difference was between a snapper, a kahawai, or a tadpole. They would not understand what it was.

I do not tell lies. I go out there and tell our people the truth, and I tell them this: they can go down to their rock, and they can go and dive for kinas. They can still go and pick tuatuas, they can still go and get a suntan—if they want to get browner than Parekura Horomia—and they can still go out and fish for kinas. They can do anything and everything that they have done historically—nothing will change. But there is humbug and claptrap out there, and those people spreading mistruths amongst our people should be ashamed of themselves. Kia ora tātou.

Gerry Brownlee: Well done, the trained seals.

I raise a point of order, Madam Speaker. That was an absolutely disgraceful interjection from the deputy leader of the National Party. I suggest that you require him to withdraw and apologise. You know exactly what he said. I will not repeat it in the House.

Madam DEPUTY SPEAKER: Did the member make an offensive remark?

Well, it depends. If one is a trained seal, being compared with the Labour Party probably would have been offensive.

Madam DEPUTY SPEAKER: It was taken as an offensive remark. Would the member like to withdraw and apologise.

GERRY BROWNLEE: For making the comment: “Well done, the trained seals.”, I withdraw and apologise.