Oral Questions

1. to the Prime Minister: Does she stand by all of her Government’s statements and actions?

Yes, insults and apologies, but I also stand by, particularly, the Families Package, implemented on this day five years ago. In the first year, around 330,000 families—more than half of all families with children in New Zealand—were, on average, $55 per week better off as a result. By 2021, regular Best Start payments were reaching 78,000 parents and caregivers with children under three years of age. On top of this, 1.2 million New Zealand adults are helped with their heating with the winter energy payment. When we came into Government, we made reducing child poverty a priority, and with that in mind, I’m proud to inform the House that weekly incomes, after housing costs, are now, on average, 43 percent higher in real terms than in 2018 for people supported by a main benefit. We are committed to helping New Zealanders and their families through the global cost of living crisis, and the research shows that we have delivered. There is more to do, and the next stage of this work will kick in from 1 April, with increases to the family tax credit, super, and main benefits. I end this year proud of our record.

💬 Christopher Luxon: Why does she think merging TVNZ and Radio New Zealand is such a good use of taxpayer money?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: As members on his side of the House who may have been exposed to some of the detail of the business case will know, TVNZ has projections they will lose $100 million a year within five years from commercial revenue. If there isn’t some form of intervention, this will continue to increasingly cost taxpayers money, and that is just one of the reasons for this intervention.

💬 Christopher Luxon: What exactly are the benefits of this merger that she is so deeply and personally committed to?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: Revenue is declining. There is an expectation that taxpayers, if they wish to still have public broadcasting, will need to invest in both Radio New Zealand—as we already do—but increasingly TVNZ. They need the flexibility to ensure that they are able to reach audiences and grow their revenue, in the case of TVNZ. That is what the merger is focused on.

💬 Christopher Luxon: Isn’t it the case that she’s already decided to cancel the merger and, if so, why won’t she just front up and say so?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: I stand by exactly what I’ve said, which is that over the summer period, I’ve asked my colleagues to make sure that as we go into 2023 we have an agenda that is clearly focused, as it has been in 2022, on supporting New Zealanders through the economically volatile situation we’re in. That won’t change the fact that public broadcasting is facing significant challenges, and solutions will be required.

💬 Christopher Luxon: Has she told Willie Jackson that she’s decided to cancel the merger yet?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: I’ve already answered that question in my previous answer. I have asked all members of the Cabinet to go away and ensure that we are focused on key priorities for 2023. I’ve made no further statements on any decisions that have been taken because I’ve done just that—given colleagues the summer.

💬 Christopher Luxon: How many times in the last five years has Grant Robertson kept to one of his Budget spending promises?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: I would be happy to review this Government’s record when compared to the last economic crisis that we faced. GDP: relative to the global financial crisis (GFC), two years later, we are at 5.2 percent. Unemployment: some of the lowest on record—half of post the GFC. Benefit rates: we are lower, in terms of New Zealanders as a proportion of the population claiming benefits, despite the crisis that we’re in. Māori unemployment: half what it was in the GFC. Pacific: half what it was after the GFC. Female unemployment: 3.3 percent. Wages up. I stand by every Budget decision this Minister has made, including in the COVID response, because that is why we have such a sound economic footing going into the next year.

💬 Hon Grant Robertson: Can the Prime Minister confirm that the extremely modest Minister of Finance has managed, before COVID, to lower debt, run surpluses, and is forecast today in the Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update to see the Government’s books come back into surplus in the 2024-25 year, five years after COVID began, compared to the six years that it took the National Party?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: I can indeed. That one, the answer therefore, is for me—I can confirm that. I can also confirm that wages are up 17 percent since 2019. It took nearly six years after the GFC for median weekly earnings to hit that similar level. Despite a crisis the likes of which this generation has not seen, the fundamentals, despite being so tested, have remained strong, and I put it down to the sound economic management of the Minister of Finance.

💬 Christopher Luxon: Why should New Zealanders believe his latest Budget spending promise when he’s failed to keep to a single one in the last five years?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: I, again, return to the things that New Zealanders will judge us by: low unemployment, low debt, returning to surplus a year earlier than the National Government managed after the GFC despite a significant economic crisis. The fundamentals of our economy are the thing that will make our foundations in 2023 stronger. It will help us weather the storms of what is a very difficult international environment.

💬 Christopher Luxon: Why did she wait five years to ask her Ministers to look for savings and to prioritise spending?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: The member is totally incorrect. As I have already said in this House, despite, again, a significant economic shock, we have seen Government spending reduce down from roughly 34, 35 percent down to closer to 31 percent. That is significant, and it is because we have consistently gone through that exercise.

Question No. 2—Prime Minister

2. to the Prime Minister: Does she stand by all her Government’s statements—even though yesterday’s one was a little bit true—and policies?

💬 SPEAKER: That is not the question that’s written here. It’s very unhelpful. We’ll just take it as read, as printed on the paper.

Yes—in particular, our support for Māori housing. Over recent weeks, Ministers have announced housing initiatives in Northland, Lower Hutt, and Muriwai. In Northland, Ministers announced a decision to fund a prototype delivery model that will see 80 to 100 affordable rental homes and up to 110 infrastructure sites by 30 June 2025; in Lower Hutt, $7.1 million was used to purchase town houses in Lower Hutt to be managed as public housing; and in Muriwai, Minister Henare opened 10 new homes built for kaumātua and whānau. In last year’s Budget, we committed $730 million for Māori housing to deliver 1,000 new homes, repairs and maintenance for 700 homes, and infrastructure support for 2,700 homes. I am proud of the support we’re giving to Māori housing to support our Māori communities.

💬 Rawiri Waititi: How can she stand by her comments that there isn’t a cost of living crisis, despite the new stats released yesterday showing food prices are 10.7 percent higher in November 2022 than they were in November 2021, beating last month as the highest annual increase since 2008?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: I think rather than get into the tit for tat, I believe that I have acknowledged the crisis that many whānau are in, and that is why, for instance, we have invested in the cost of living payment, the increases to the family tax credit, and the fuel excise reductions that you see now. Even though we are phasing them out, we at the same time are timing it so that, when we hit 1 April, we’ll see another increase in the family tax credit, in main benefits, and in superannuation. We are incredibly mindful that next year and this have been tough, and that is why we’ve provided targeted and timely support, rather than some of the other policies that have been bounced around by other members in this House which would leave our lower and middle income earners with far less in their pockets.

💬 Rawiri Waititi: Why is she standing by the decision not to regulate prices or adopt my member’s bill to remove GST from kai, which would have ensured that whānau can afford to put kai on their table this Christmas?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: This has been a policy that actually, in good faith, the Labour Party have themselves considered before, and in that consideration one of the issues that we had concern over was whether or not you could guarantee that any of those GST reductions would be retained and genuinely passed on to families. What we have instead done is work on what we believe are systemic issues, and what the Commerce Commission have said are systemic issues, in our grocery sector. We do not have a competitive and well-functioning grocery sector. Kiwis are paying the price, to the tune of an extra $1 million a day in additional revenue, and that is why we are undertaking the reform we are to make sure that we fix the system as a whole, regardless of what’s happening with inflation.

💬 Rawiri Waititi: Will she recognise the challenges of surviving through a cost of living crisis by providing a Christmas bonus to families this summer, like her Labour predecessor Michael Joseph Savage once did; if not, why not?

💬 Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: As the member will know, I am a huge follower of Michael—I was going to say “Michael Joseph Savage”; him as well—but also Norman Kirk, because of the focus and unrelenting focus they had on the importance of having a safety net to support families. Yes, Norman Kirk did give a Christmas bonus, but our focus has been on lifting main benefit rates on a consistent basis, and we’ve done that. As our review of the Families Package has demonstrated—and you can read the data the Ministry of Social Development has released today—we now have weekly incomes after housing costs, on average, 43 percent higher in real terms since 2018 for people on main benefits. Ours is not a bonus; it is a consistent lift, because that is what has been required.

Question No. 3—Finance

3. to the Minister of Finance: What are the Government’s priorities for Budget 2023?

Budget 2023 will continue to prioritise New Zealand’s overall wellbeing and economic security through what will be a difficult year for the global economy, facing the challenge of inflation and also projections of an economic slowdown. The Government’s primary focus at next year’s Budget will be on supporting families and households experiencing cost of living pressures. Alongside that, we will continue to carefully and responsibly manage our finances. Government spending as a percentage of GDP is expected to fall over the forecast period and support the direction of monetary policy to bring inflation down. We will continue our balanced approach in Budget 2023. We will also need to ensure we’re investing in getting our public services and the basics of them right, particularly in areas like health, education, housing, and infrastructure, and also look to the future for an economy that has high wages, low emissions, and provides economic security.

💬 Barbara Edmonds: What other objectives and priorities is the Government focusing on?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: As I said, the Government’s economic plan is to move New Zealanders towards creating high-wage jobs in a low-emissions economy while providing economic security. In order to do this, we must continue to invest in skills and innovation to get us there while continuing to address climate change issues as well.

💬 Barbara Edmonds: How is the Government prioritising its support for New Zealanders facing cost of living pressures?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: In the immediate term, the Government is extending the petrol excise duty cut in full to the end of February, and then to the end of March at half that level. Half-price public transport will extend to the end of March. The Government has invested over $1 billion over the past year to reduce fuel prices and extend public transport subsidies. The estimate of the extension announced today was a further $116 million. It is not sustainable to continue to subsidise the cost of petrol indefinitely, for everyone. We have to strike a balance between broad, ongoing support and careful management of the Government’s accounts; that’s why we are transitioning to more targeted support for those most in need. That will begin in the public transport area with the Community Connect policy, giving half-price public transport to community services card holders from 1 April. The extensions that we’ve announced today are also timed to link up with significant income increases on 1 April for seniors, students, beneficiaries, those receiving Working for Families and childcare support. This is all about making sure we take a careful and balanced approach in what will be a difficult year.

💬 Nicola Willis: Can he confirm that from next year the Government will spend more money servicing the interest costs of the Government debt it has accumulated than it will spend on law and order?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: I can’t confirm that in the House. What I can confirm is that, as a percentage of GDP, yes, our financing costs will lift, because it will be obvious to everybody that interests rates around the world are lifting. I invite the member to have a think about what she would do if she wanted to reduce those—for example, put herself back into her fiscal Bermuda Triangle where she thinks she can somehow or other reduce debt, increase spending, and cut taxes—not possible.

💬 Hon Chris Hipkins: Can the Minister of Finance confirm that the Government has no intention of reinstating the freeze on police funding that was in place under the last National Government?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: Yes, indeed, I can confirm that, and I’m very proud of the fact that we have been a Government that is on our way to fulfilling the 1,800 extra police. We see more police on the beat, more money being invested in crime, rather than the freeze and the cuts we saw from the National Party.

💬 Barbara Edmonds: What is the economic environment in which Budget 2023 will be delivered?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: Treasury today released its latest economic and fiscal forecast in the 2022 Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update. The deterioration in global growth will affect New Zealand. We will enter into a shallow slowdown, but we will do this from a strong starting point, with Treasury forecasting that real GDP will increase by 1.8 percent across the second half of 2022, and with unemployment at a near-record low: 3.3 percent. Looking ahead, Treasury is forecasting economic growth will slow in 2023 but there will be a gradual recovery from 2024 onwards.

💬 Barbara Edmonds: What is the impact of economic conditions on the Government’s books?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: The resilience of the economy in the face of the global slowdown will see the Government’s books back in surplus in 2024-25, a year earlier than it took the National Party after the global financial crisis. In the two years between now and surplus, deficits are a combined $5.1 billion smaller than forecast in the May 2022 Budget. Net debt is forecast to peak at 21.4 percent of GDP and then reduce to 14.1 percent by the end of the forecast period. This is well below many of the countries we compare ourselves with. The Government’s strategy of reducing deficits and returning the books to surplus is helping to reduce demand pressure on the economy and will provide us with the flexibility to respond to a testing global environment.

💬 Nicola Willis: Does he think rebranding “recession” in New Zealand as “a speed bump” will make any difference to New Zealanders staring down the barrel of rapidly rising interest rates, a cost of living crisis, plummeting house prices, and rising unemployment?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: As I’ve said on many occasions in this House, we know that it will be tough and has been tough for many New Zealand households facing cost of living pressures. That’s why we’ve stepped up to support low and middle income families, in particular, to be able to get through that. But I invite the member, tomorrow, when the GDP figures come out, if this is her line of logic, for her to put out the congratulatory press release that she no doubt will do. If she’s going to blame us for it, she might like to look at tomorrow’s numbers. We’re going to see, according to Treasury, 1.8 percent growth in the second half of this year. The New Zealand economy is as well positioned as any economy in the world to deal with the challenges that face us.

Question No. 4—Oceans and Fisheries

4. to the Minister for Oceans and Fisheries: Does he agree with the Minister of Conservation that New Zealand supports a global protection target of 30 percent of land and sea areas by 2030; if so, what progress, if any, has the Government made toward achieving this in the Hauraki Gulf/Tīkapa Moana since October 2020?

Yes, and New Zealand, led by the Minister of Conservation, is active in negotiations currently under way in Montreal at the 15th Conference of the Parties to the UN Convention on Biological Diversity to support this target. In respect of the Hauraki Gulf, extensive engagement on our proposals has concluded and decisions by Cabinet are imminent.

💬 Hon Eugenie Sage: Does he have any early Christmas gifts and good tidings for the dolphins, seabirds, fish, and marine life of the Hauraki Gulf about protecting them from the impacts of commercial and recreational fishing?

💬 Hon DAVID PARKER: Trawling for bad news though the member may be, I think she’s probably floundering to find it, and I am pleased to say that there’s lots of good news on the way.

💬 Hon Eugenie Sage: When does he expect to be able to make any announcements on the 19 marine protection areas proposed for the Hauraki Gulf in the Government’s Revitalising the Gulf report, when he told this House in March that those decisions were expected later this year?

💬 Hon DAVID PARKER: Well, indeed, I’ve actually got a paper at Cabinet committee tomorrow morning on those very issues and am expecting public announcements to be made early in the new year.

💬 Hon Eugenie Sage: Does he accept the finding in the MartinJenkins Ltd report that commercial fishing in the proposed protection areas accounts for just 1 to 3 percent of the total greenweight of fish caught commercially across all quota-management areas that include the Gulf; if so, will he be more ambitious and seriously consider phasing out bottom trawling across all of the Gulf?

💬 Hon DAVID PARKER: Bottom trawling is already prohibited in a large part of the Gulf. Trawling is proposed to be further limited to some narrower trawl corridors which we are consulting upon. In respect of the data that the member mentioned in her question, I don’t deny it.

💬 Hon Eugenie Sage: Does he agree with Forest & Bird’s description of bottom trawling in the Hauraki Gulf as being the equivalent of driving a bulldozer through the Waitakere Ranges to pick mushrooms; if not, why not?

💬 Hon DAVID PARKER: No, because there are no mushrooms at sea.

💬 Hon Eugenie Sage: Does he agree that, to align with the targets under discussion in Montreal, New Zealand should be protecting at least 30 percent of our own globally significant marine area by 2030; if so, how does he think we are tracking towards that goal?

💬 Hon DAVID PARKER: Yes, and I think this Government’s going to make significant progress in the not too distant future.

Question No. 5—Finance

5. to the Minister of Finance: Does he stand by his statement that “every day of the week we look to see what savings and reprioritisations we can make”; if so, what specific savings or reprioritisations has he identified this week?

I stand by my full statement that “The Prime Minister issues quite a few instructions, and I have in front of me here the Budget 2021 savings initiatives and the Budget 2022 savings initiatives. We take very seriously our job as responsible fiscal managers, and every day of the week we look to see what savings and reprioritisations we can make.” As we work towards Budget 2023, I can confirm we are doing this. Just today, the Budget Policy Statement has identified how about $3 billion of appropriations marked and forecast for COVID spending have been returned to the centre over the past two years.

💬 Nicola Willis: Does he think that part of the Government’s problem is that the Prime Minister issues so many different instructions from one headline to the next that her Ministers have been unable to properly prioritise spending and focus on getting the basics right?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: Oh, no, I think the Prime Minister’s pretty focused in the instructions that she gives us—savings is one of those areas. The member could probably save us all a bit of time by rolling Chris Luxon now rather than later.

💬 Nicola Willis: Why did the Prime Minister make such a point of asking Ministers to review—[Interruption]

💬 SPEAKER: What’s the rule? Silence.

💬 Nicola Willis: Why did the Prime Minister make such a point of asking Ministers to review their spending priorities over summer if this is, as the Minister of Finance asserts, business as usual from his Government?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: I believe the Prime Minister made the point in a series of interviews—I’m sure if you look back over time, you’ll see that both her and I have been seeking throughout our time in Government to make sure we get value for money and that we reprioritise. As I did say to the member yesterday, I’m more than happy to table for her the savings from Budget 2021 and the savings from Budget 2022—I can’t because they’re in the public domain, but they’re there for her to read.

💬 Nicola Willis: So are New Zealanders meant to believe that despite this being the biggest spending Government ever, with a finance Minister that’s broken every operating allowance he’s ever set, this time—this time—it will be different because the Prime Minister’s read the focus group report and knows she’s got to get the spending under control?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: A few people might have read the focus group report in this House, and that’s why I answered the way I did in my earlier question.

💬 Nicola Willis: Will he commit, today, to account for all the money from taxpayers that has been spent to date on the TVNZ-RNZ merger, the development of his jobs tax, and any other wasteful projects that the Prime Minister decides to put on the scrap heap after her summer break?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: The Prime Minister’s already answered questions today about what she’s asked Ministers to do over summer. In answer to the first part of the member’s question, there’s a process we have for accounting for the expenditure of the Government; it’s called the Budget.

💬 Hon Stuart Nash: Does the Minister ask his Ministers to review their spending ambitions as part of every Budget process?

💬 Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: Yes, I do, with particular focus on the work of the Minister for Economic and Regional Development.

Question No. 6—Education

6. to the Minister of Education: What support has the Government contributed to help schools to provide learning environments for their students that are warm, dry, and fit for purpose?

Since 2018, this Government has committed $3.8 billion of new capital spending to improve school property. This has included funding for the National Education Growth Plan to build new schools and classrooms for our growing population, the National School Redevelopment Programme to address the poor condition of some of our school buildings that we inherited, and the School Investment Programme, which provided funding to nearly every State school to bring forward and complete much-needed property projects. To put this into perspective, over $5.7 billion has been spent on school property between 2018 and 2020, compared to just $2.9 billion in the preceding five years.

💬 Angela Roberts: What has been delivered in terms of additional student places from the spending?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: Thirty thousand and sixty-eight additional student places have been delivered through the building of new schools and new classrooms to the year ending on 30 September 2022. Another 12,968 places are currently under construction, and there are a further 51,564 places that are being planned or designed at the moment.

💬 Angela Roberts: What has been delivered in terms of school redevelopments from this spending?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: The level of school redevelopment work up and down the country also continues to increase. Over 70 major redevelopment projects, worth over $528 million, have been completed since 2019—nearly half of those completed in the last year. Another 51 major projects, worth $632 million, are currently in construction, providing much-needed upgrades to our existing school infrastructure.

💬 Angela Roberts: What other support has the Government provided?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: We’ve provided funding to improve the internal environments of over 600 State and State-integrated schools that are in small or remote areas. The school investment package was a one-off capital injection to most State schools that helped them to accelerate upgrade and improvement works. Four thousand four hundred and ninety-nine projects have been completed or are in delivery, at over 2,000 schools across New Zealand. The state of the school property portfolio we inherited five years ago was nothing short of disgraceful. We have been taking work and delivering results in improving it.

Question No. 7—Local Government

7. to the Minister of Local Government: Why did she not send the advice she received on 22 November relating to entrenchment of provisions of the Water Services Entities Bill to any other Ministers, and does she stand by all her statements on entrenchments?

As stated in my personal explanation in the House, the advice sought on Supplementary Order Paper (SOP) 285 in the name of Eugenie Sage was technical in nature and not passed on. To the second part of the question, I also stand by my comment that it was a mistake, it has been resolved through the introduction of SOP 310, and there is no entrenchment clause in the Water Services Entities Bill.

💬 Simon Watts: Why did she not share that advice with the Minister of Justice, given she is required to consult on all constitutional arrangements with that Minister under section 5.14(d) of the Cabinet Manual?

💬 Hon NANAIA MAHUTA: As previously stated in other questions, that SOP was tabled by Eugenie Sage. The advice sought was technical in nature and not passed on.

💬 Simon Watts: Will the Minister table the advice she received on entrenchment on 25 October and 22 November in the House right now; if not, why not?

💬 Hon NANAIA MAHUTA: As previously said in other responses to that member, a mistake has been acknowledged, it has been fixed, there is no constitutional crisis, and there is no entrenchment clause in the Water Services Entities Bill.

💬 Simon Watts: How does she reconcile her statements that entrenchment was, I quote, “a mistake”, when she had received advice twice on it, including on the day of the debate and a month beforehand, and isn’t it really the case that this was no mistake but a deliberate and calculated action?

💬 Hon NANAIA MAHUTA: No, I don’t agree with the member. And, in a charitable spirit, if that member keeps barking up the wrong tree and he wants to keep that dog whistle up, I suggest he choose a Christmas carol.

💬 Hon Dr Megan Woods: Probably got it hanging out of the garage in South Auckland.

💬 SPEAKER: The Hon Dr Megan Woods will stand, withdraw, and apologise.

💬 Hon Dr Megan Woods: I withdraw and apologise.

💬 Simon Watts: Did she know that, prior to the vote on Supplementary Order Paper 285, the Labour Party members would vote in favour of SOP 285?

💬 Hon NANAIA MAHUTA: The vote was placed on the day; it has been subsequently rectified because we’ve acknowledged a mistake was made. The matter has been dealt with: there is no entrenchment clause in the Water Services Entities Bill; there is no constitutional crisis.

💬 Chris Bishop: Point of order. That was a very clear and deliberate question which went to the Minister’s knowledge about a particular matter. It was not addressed.

💬 SPEAKER: I’ll ask the member to ask it again.

💬 Simon Watts: Did she know, prior to the vote on SOP 285, that the Labour Party members would vote in favour of SOP 285?

💬 SPEAKER: I’ll ask the Minister to answer in so far as she has responsibility for that.

💬 Hon NANAIA MAHUTA: I acted in accordance with decisions made by our caucus in relation to SOP 285—it was acknowledged that a mistake was made. It has been rectified: there is no entrenchment clause in the Water Services Entities Bill. There is no constitutional crisis. I suggest that, in a charitable spirit, the member moves positively into Christmas and has a bit of a break.

Question No. 8—Social Development and Employment

8. to the Minister for Social Development and Employment: What research has she seen on the impact of the Families Package five years after its introduction?

Five years ago today, we announced the Families Package. The package was an overdue boost to incomes for many families across New Zealand. Ministry of Social Development (MSD) research released today shows it has made a real difference to increasing incomes for New Zealanders. In the first year, around 330,000 families—more than half of all families with children in New Zealand—were, on average, $55 per week better off as a result of the Families Package. By 2021, regular Best Start payments were reaching 78,000 parents and caregivers with children under three years old. On top of this, each year, over 1 million New Zealand adults have been helped with their heating through winter by the winter energy payment. When we first came into Government, we were clear about our priority to support New Zealand families. MSD research shows that through the Families Package, we have delivered on our promise, and we will keep delivering.

💬 Angie Warren-Clark: What other initiatives did the Families Package deliver?

💬 Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: Alongside Best Start and the winter energy payment, the Government increased the family tax credit abatement threshold and support for caregivers through increases to the orphans benefit, unsupported child benefit, and foster care allowance. We increased paid parental leave to 26 weeks, reinstated the independent earner tax credit, and increased the accommodation supplement. Through our changes, which started with the Families Package, child poverty statistics have trended down in all of the nine measures we monitor. Little did we know how important these changes would be for preparing us well for a pandemic and the current globally influenced challenges we face.

💬 Angie Warren-Clark: What other initiatives has the Government undertaken since the Families Package which support New Zealand families?

💬 Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: Since the announcement of the Families Package, we’ve worked hard over our five years in Government to increase incomes and reduce hardship for families. This includes increasing benefits to historic levels, increasing the minimum wage to $21.20 per hour, implementing and expanding our lunches in schools programme, extending free doctors’ visits, building more social housing than any Government since the 1970s, and making significant investments into upskilling and training opportunities to support people into work. Our continued efforts have made a difference. We are supporting New Zealanders to get ahead and realise their potential, evidenced by record numbers of people exiting benefit for work and a near-record low unemployment rate.

💬 Angie Warren-Clark: What will be the focus for 2023?

💬 Hon CARMEL SEPULONI: In the Prime Minister’s Speech from the Throne after the 2017 election, she stated, “People will always be at the heart of this Government.” This continues to be our priority as we move forward. It has guided our decision making and will continue to be what drives us. Five years on from the launch of the Families Package, it is important to recognise how far we’ve come, despite all of the challenges that we’ve had to respond to along the way as a nation. I want to reiterate our Government’s commitment to all New Zealanders. People will always be at the heart of this Government.

Question No. 9—Education

9. to the Minister of Education: Is he confident Te Pūkenga is on track to achieve its objectives, and how much, if anything, has been spent to date on redundancy payments for senior executives?

After a difficult year, I am confident that Te Pūkenga are back on track. However, there is still a lot of work to do over the next year and beyond. I do not hold a figure in response to the second part of the question. I have been advised that there have been a number of redundancies across the Te Pūkenga network and that these will be reported in the Te Pūkenga annual report in the normal way.

💬 Penny Simmonds: Why have so many senior executives abandoned the Minister’s Te Pūkenga reforms, and does he accept responsibility for hundreds of thousands of dollars of taxpayer money being paid out to senior executives?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: I would reject the premise in the member’s question. If someone has been made redundant, that doesn’t mean that they are abandoning the network; it means that there is rationalisation going on across the country in order to reduce costs in senior management and gain the greater efficiencies that we have been striving for.

💬 Penny Simmonds: Can he confirm that nearly 500 staff will be made redundant by the end of 2026, according to the Te Pūkenga programme business case version 15, and does the Minister think that these staff will see large payouts of hundreds of thousands of dollars to senior executives as fair?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: In terms of whatever payments people who are made redundant receive, that’s a matter for Te Pūkenga to follow employment law—and, of course, good faith—when those decisions are made. But we were absolutely clear when we established the Te Pūkenga organisation that we believe that there are greater efficiencies that can be gained by having one national organisation rather than 16, and, as a result, yes, there are likely to be significant changes. We also need to be upfront about the fact that record-low or near record-low unemployment is meaning that Te Pūkenga and private training establishments and other vocational education providers are facing a softer pattern of enrolments, and that is going to result in them having to look very carefully at their costs to make sure that they don’t run unsustainable deficits, as the system was operating when we became the Government.

💬 Penny Simmonds: Was any due diligence done on the merger of 16 polytechnics and eight industry training organisations (ITOs) with different IT systems, given his comment on the Nine to Noon radio show that low to mid hundreds of millions of dollars need to be spent on creating common student management and finance systems, on top of the $200 million already spent?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: That is the nature of the business case process.

💬 Penny Simmonds: Can the Minister explain how creating new layers of dysfunctional management and bureaucracy on top of our polytechnics has in any way improved the financial sustainability or education performance of the sector, and is he concerned that his legacy as education Minister will be a costly failure that has wasted millions of dollars, distracted the sector, and delivered absolutely nothing for students?

💬 Hon CHRIS HIPKINS: No, I absolutely reject the premise of the member’s question. What I can say is that we are focused on reducing costs within the vocational education system so that we can direct that funding into delivering better outcomes for learners—something the member might have focused on when she was chief executive at Southern Institute of Technology, given they had some of the worst learner outcomes in the country during the time that she was the chief executive of that organisation. The fact that we have a declining pattern of enrolments in provider-based training and an increased number of people going into apprenticeships and work-based learning highlights the benefits of the reform programme in bringing those two systems together to create more sustainable vocational education in New Zealand. If the last Government had been focused on delivering sustainable vocational education, we wouldn’t have the critical skills shortages that we have now.

💬 SPEAKER: Any further supplementaries? Jolly good.

Question No. 10—Immigration

10. to the Minister of Immigration: What reports has he seen regarding migration to New Zealand?

This week, I saw reporting from Stats New Zealand showing a net migration gain for the seventh consecutive month, with 11,400 people arriving in the country in October 2022, compared to 8,000 people departing—or a net gain of around 3,300 people. Further to this, I saw data yesterday from Immigration New Zealand that suggested this trend has continued through the month of November as well, with a number of arrivals in the country totalling over 423,000 people, compared to around 374,000 departures—a net figure of 49,470 arrivals, with a positive flow of both New Zealand passport holders and non - New Zealand passport holders. This is reflected in the huge demand we’re seeing for visitor and work visas, in particular, the working holiday scheme, for which we have now granted 40,000 visas and welcomed 22,000 people on shore. This shows that while the domestic and international labour markets do remain very tight, our immigration rebalance is beginning to work well and that while we will need to make changes from time to time, as we did earlier this week, to maintain our competitiveness, our immigration system is well-placed to be responsive to international conditions and support our reconnection to the world.

💬 Jo Luxton: Why is the strong trend in net migration important?

💬 Hon MICHAEL WOOD: New Zealand’s reconnection with the world over recent months has enabled friends and family to reconnect with each other, sometimes after long periods apart. It’s also important in terms of boosting our economy through tourism and getting the skills into New Zealand that we need in different parts of our economy. Our immigration rebalance has been about shifting away from the old low-wage, low-skill, high-exploitation model to a system that values migrants and builds the skills that we need to be a productive and prosperous country. There’s ongoing work to do, we’ll keep listening to sectors who are experiencing challenges, but in amongst that, I’m optimistic that this trend will continue, and we’ll see further positive results in 2023.

💬 Erica Stanford: Has he seen reports from today that have showed Treasury reducing its growth forecast from earlier in the year because of lower levels of expected migration, and does he think this shows the Reserve Bank Governor was right when he said that this Government’s immigration policies have meant that interest rates will have to go higher as a result?

💬 Hon MICHAEL WOOD: In response to the second part of the member’s questions, I don’t think that is a fair reflection on the Reserve Bank Governor’s comments; he, in fact, acknowledged the complexities of immigration and its impact on inflation.

💬 Jo Luxton: What is the Government doing to attract migrants to New Zealand and fill skill shortages?

💬 Hon MICHAEL WOOD: Since our borders opened, the Government has taken a number of steps to support businesses to recruit internationally to fill labour shortages. We’ve approved over 94,000 job positions for international recruitment through the job check process. We’ve reopened the Pacific Access Category Resident Visa and Samoan Quota Resident Visa, delivered the largest increase in a decade to the Recognised Seasonal Employer scheme, resumed the Skilled Migrant Category Resident Visa and Parent Resident Visa schemes, and, this week, expanded the Green List further to ensure that employers remain highly competitive when recruiting internationally. This complements the significant work that we’ve done to train and upskill New Zealanders to meet skill shortages consistent with the principles of the immigration rebalance, with over 200,000 people having taken up free apprenticeships or trade training since July 2020. We’ve done that at the same time as we’ve continued to look to improve wages for New Zealanders across our economy; that’s important on this side of the House.

💬 Jo Luxton: What recent feedback has he heard regarding the Government’s efforts to attract migrants to New Zealand?

💬 Hon MICHAEL WOOD: I note Business New Zealand chief executive Kirk Hope described the changes we announced yesterday as positive and that they would help in meeting skill shortages across a range of industries. I also note the Motor Trade Association described the addition of skilled motor mechanics to the Green List as a massive boost to the industry. The Civil Contractors New Zealand said that the construction roles that had been added to the Green List would provide a great benefit to communities at a time where skilled tradespeople are in hot demand globally.

💬 Hon Kieran McAnulty: On this, the last day of Parliament and 11 days before Christmas, can the Minister confirm to Kiwi kids that Santa Claus has all necessary documentation to enter New Zealand?

💬 Hon MICHAEL WOOD: I have received one application for a short-term work visa from the North Pole. I can confirm that, as Minister, I have issued a special direction in spite of immigration instructions for him. I’ve spoken to the Minister of Customs about expediting customs clearance for the 12 live animals that will be coming in with him. I’ve also talked with the Minister of Trade and confirmed that the EU free-trade agreement provisions mean that no tariffs will apply to the large cargo that he’s bringing into New Zealand. The Minister for Workplace Relations and Safety has advised that, despite their small size, the elves who are also being sponsored on the visa must be paid the full minimum wage of $21.20 per hour. This visa will be a big boost to New Zealand’s economy and is further evidence that the team in red always delivers.

💬 SPEAKER: Both question and answer would have been better suited for the adjournment debate.

💬 Erica Stanford: Supplementary question, Mr Speaker—supplementary Christmas question, Mr Speaker, in the spirit of—

💬 SPEAKER: Pardon?

💬 Erica Stanford: I said, supplementary Christmas question, in the spirit of the—

💬 SPEAKER: Yeah, why not.

💬 Erica Stanford: Can the Minister confirm that Santa’s family will also be included on this visa, given that so many split families in New Zealand of migrants are still waiting to be separated, nearly three years after our borders were closed.

💬 Hon MICHAEL WOOD: I can confirm that visas have been issued to the whole family group, and I can also confirm that Santa Claus is very aware of the difference between Honolulu and Te Puke, so he won’t get lost on the way.

💬 SPEAKER: Let’s stop there.

Question No. 11—Children

11. to the Minister for Children: Does he stand by his statement that “when a child is identified or apprehended by Police for offending behaviour, information will be shared with Oranga Tamariki within 24 hours, with an agreed plan on how to deal with and support the young person confirmed in 48 hours”; if so, how does he expect this to be delivered while Oranga Tamariki faces more than 500 vacancies?

The circuit-breaker intervention the Government announced last week responds directly to the needs of the areas where the programme is being piloted. We also made sure to focus on areas where we knew this could be rolled out quickly and effectively. During the development of this initiative, Police and Oranga Tamariki (OT) worked together to make sure they had the staff and resources to deliver support for families.

💬 Karen Chhour: Does the Minister truly believe it is feasible for Oranga Tamariki, Police, education, health, social development, iwi Māori, community organisations, and whānau all to cooperate and confirm a plan within 48 hours, as he announced; and, if he pulls this off, will it be the most efficient Government operation ever?

💬 Hon KELVIN DAVIS: It’s already happening in South Auckland.

💬 Karen Chhour: Does the Minister have full confidence in this initiative, considering that multiple reviews, including the Independent Children’s Monitor, could not guarantee OT was meeting national care standards, with cases of staff at breaking point; and, how many action plans are currently being made for young offenders within 48 hours, if any?

💬 Hon KELVIN DAVIS: As I said, it’s already happening in South Auckland. I invite the member to go and visit Kotahi te Whakaaro and she can see for herself.

💬 David Seymour: Point of order. The second leg of the question—the first wasn’t addressed at all, but the second leg was about how many, and there have been previous questions about whether it’s happening. This question was designed to drill deeper and find out how many. The Minister didn’t address that—the number of action plans being put in place—at all.

💬 SPEAKER: The question was definitely addressed. The member has further supplementaries—she can explore that.

💬 Karen Chhour: What advice, if any, has the Minister received on the feasibility of this policy nationwide?

💬 Hon KELVIN DAVIS: As I said, it’s already happening based on Kotahi te Whakaaro in South Auckland. The advice I received actually was from when I went to visit and I spoke with all of the agencies and the NGOs, who were sitting around the table describing how effective it has been. That’s the best form of advice you can get.

Question No. 12—Health

12. to the Associate Minister of Health: What progress has been made towards a smokefree New Zealand?

I’m pleased to say that yesterday this House passed the Smokefree Environments and Regulated Products (Smoked Tobacco) Amendment Bill into law. This will see three changes to tobacco in New Zealand: we will reduce the amount of nicotine that is allowed in smoked tobacco products, the number of retailers that sell tobacco will decrease, and we will ensure tobacco is not sold to anyone born on or after 1 January 2009.

💬 Tangi Utikere: What impact is this bill likely to have?

💬 Hon Dr AYESHA VERRALL: Changes in this bill will result in thousands of people living longer, healthier lives. An entire generation will be smokefree, which will save thousands of lives, and the health system will be better off for not needing to treat illnesses caused by smoking—such as numerous types of cancer, heart attacks, strokes and amputations—saving an estimated $5 billion in health expenditure. We have been making great strides towards a smokefree future, with our smoking rates now down to 8 percent. However, without this bill, it would have taken decades for Māori to reach the 5 percent goal originally set by the Māori Affairs Committee.

💬 Tangi Utikere: What feedback has she received on this announcement?

💬 Hon Dr AYESHA VERRALL: The feedback has been positive. The Cancer Society of New Zealand described this legislation as “bold and brave”, with tobacco being the most harmful consumer product in history. We have seen firsthand the devastating impact it has on individuals and their whānau. Selah Hart, CEO of Hāpai Te Hauora, spoke to BBC News about this world-leading step to addressing the underlying issue of tobacco. And Catherine Manning, regional manager of Takiri Mai Te Ata Regional Stop Smoking Service, said we can now finally protect our mokopuna, and noted the importance of engagement with communities through this transition. These community organisations, such as Takiri Mai Te Ata, are essential in providing stop smoking programmes, which we continue to support through funding from Budget 2021 to scale up services, alongside health promotion.

💬 Tangi Utikere: So how will this bill help our community?

💬 Hon Dr AYESHA VERRALL: The measures in this bill aim to create equitable outcomes to make sure that Māori and Pasifika also reach our smokefree goal and share in a better future. The measures will close the life expectancy gap for Māori women by 25 percent, and 10 percent for Māori men. As we look forward to the summer holidays, we all want more time with our whānau, we want time with our families, and friends to live long, healthy lives. We want more summers and Christmases together. For anyone seeking to make a change and quit smoking in 2023, I encourage you to contact Quitline on 0800 778 778. Kia kaha.